2" x 3" Training Arms

[dgemmill]

I saw a couple of postings mentioning using 2" x 3" Training Arms on their Things. I have been told 1" back is max. Can you guys who have implemented the 2" x 3" Training Arms let me know if you had to do anything else for clearance? Do you have a body lift, other?

I prefer not to go with a body lift. I have cut & turned my front end and adjusted the rear for 16" of ground clearance. Unfortunatley, the angle is eating up CV's so I have to go to 930's. When I do this I want to change out the Trailing Arms, torsions (26mm), and will have to replace the axles.

Any insight you can provide would be greatly appreciated.

[Mattt]

Are you just learning how to drive your Thing with those "training arms"? Sorry I couldnt resist!

Anyway, I have 1" longer arms on mine, and I tend to agree with you. I dont see how the longer arms are possible without cutting out the rear fender opening.
However, if you ever saw the maroon colored "Wild Thing" he says he had 3 X 3s on that car. I saw it in person, and it was hard to tell if they were 3 X 3s. Im almost thinking 1 X 3s, or 2 X3s(first # length) at the most. All boxed arms look VERY similar to me when I dont have another one to compare to right there.

Perfect example,,,I had Jeff at Kymco install the new RR wheel bearings in my Boxed 1" longer Susp. Unl. arms, and he asked me what they were going in. I told him a Thing, and he said "Cool, going agro with the Thing and these 3 X 3s." Then I pointed out they werent 3 X 3s.

If I was going to change anything about my install, I would have new IRS pivot mounts welded in. The camber is just a bit off when bolting in aftermarket arms to a stock pivot point. I already have the 930s, and a body lift. Are you running SAW axles, or stock axles? The SAW axles can sometimes help you stay with stock CVs if you arent hyper extending them. The SAW axles are floaters, while the stock axles are fixed position which pulls the CV apart.

If you wanted to see what one looks like done, get in touch with me. I would like to see your T4 powered Thing that you mentioned in a prior post.

[dgemmill]

Matt,
Yea, I'm a beginner and the training arms are really helping. To bad it doesn't help my typing skills.

Currently I have stock axles and German Thing CV's from German Motors. My axle angle is about 23 degrees which is excessive. My back seat is a short (seat area) PNP 52" wide and my oldest boy is 6' tall. I am considering having the package tray cut so I can move the rear seat back when I have the torsions, trailing arms, axles & CV's done. I am torn between staying within the body or cutting the fenders and engine cover to make room.

I notice in your profile that you are in Anaheim. I am in Rowland Heights next to Diamond Bar. You wouldn't be the Matt that was parting out an rusted Thing would you?

Anyway, I would be happy to show you what I did for the Bus box and Type 4 motor. I love the motor, it has been built to 2467cc and has loads of torque compared to a type 1. It really works well in the heavy Thing.

I am currently struggling with an electrical short. I can't locate it and it keeps draining my battery. Anyone know a good electrical trouble shooter in So. Cal.?

[LB181]

dgemmill, How did you put the Type IV in your Thing? Did you use stock cooling or did you convert to an upright setup?

[Bob Ingman]

Got photos? We`d all like to see. Good luck. Bob Ingman

[Mattt]

Dave,

Thats me.

23 degrees is almost pushing it with 930s, no less, Thing CVs. How are you measuring that angle?

I already have the bus trans(quiet mount), but, did you convert the T-4 to upright, or is it stock cooling tin? Who built this engine for you, and did you install it or have it done? That sounds like a great package in the Thing.

[Bob Ingman]

Mattt ,while we`re on this topic I would like to ask your opinion since you have a lift on your Thing.
Do you think a T-4 pancake will fit in a Thing that has been lifted. I`m personally thinking that the lift is going to place the engine opening above points of contact with a bus engine and stock air cleaners. What do you think?
I intend to do it one way or the other but at this point feel the engine opening will need litle or no cutting.
I do`nt have possession of the other Thing I bought but I do have a rear photo that shows the generator pulley just barely clearing the tin in the engine bay and the crank pulley is well below the rear apron. All this gives me the impression that it will go.
I intend to use the 5 rib trans with it (1800cc carbed bus engine) and install them as a unit such as is done when going into the bus. I think people fail to realize how much room is in the rear of the thing as compared to any other VW that I can think of.
I too am going through CVs after rotating the rear torsion bars. I`m hoping the 2x3 arms will solve this. It would be a cheap way out. Planning to use bus trans, bus axles w/T-4 CVs, bus stubs and bus drums and brakes. Then selling all the 181 stuff for a cash kick back. Should come out pretty cheap that way.
Anyway let me know what you think about the pancake/lift kit combo. Good luck. Bob Ingman

[dgemmill]

I used the German Auto upright conversion shroud with the Type 1 alternator. I have dual 44IDF Webers that barely clear the metal behind the motor.

I had Pepe at the Baja Shop in Orange put the Engine and Trans in. Pepe has done some awesome off-road Things. I have pictures of one they call the Senators car. Built for a Senator in Mexico I am told.

I had Donny Krakkaur build my motor. Donny used to work at German Auto and now builds motors out of his garage. I had 105 Cylinders added, Large Valve heads, and a Web Cam for a total displacement of 2467cc.
I run the car 75/25 street vs off-road. I tow the Thing behind my Motorhome where ever we go. So the car has to be driveable for my wife. This engine lugs down nicely and has plenty of getup and go when you put your foot in it. I did have to trim the engine area some and cut the chassis below the engine lid. The part cut bolts back into place so it should be barely visible when I get it repainted.

When you buy the German Auto shrould it is not completely finished. You will need to do some minor trimming and sanding to complete it. Then paint to your favorite color. I don't have any pictures of the engine compartment, but I have a digital camera and can take some this weekend to share.

[LB181]

Your car sounds really cool. I would really like to see some pictures of it if possible. Maybe even the "Sentator's Car."

Corey

[Kubelmann]

This thread is old home week. So many Thing pals here. Very cool. I am almost done putting in the Porsche 944 arms and rear discs together. I will report as soon as everything is cranked up and inline. K-mann

[dgemmill]

I have posted some pictures of the Type IV motor in my car at
http://www.geocities.com/davidgemmill/GemmillThing.html

The quality of the pictures posted are pretty bad but the pictures themselves are pretty good. If you are interested in copies of the jpegs let me know and I can email them. They run 4-500K each.

I can also email pictures of the senators car to interested parties.

[dgemmill]

Bob,
You asked about putting a pancake Type IV in your Thing. I don't believe there is any way that would fit. With the upright German Auto Fan Shroud I have about 2 to 2 1/2" from the back of the pulley to the front of the Hood Latch brakets. The Pancake style cooling adds much more than that.

[Bob Ingman]

Dave, thanks for posting the photos for us.
I`m using a DTM kit now and room is tight but all is accessable. I have to remove intakes to install the engine. I really like the way that you have cut the lower body panels. Something which I plan also. I`m certainly impressed by how neatly you have done it. I always liked swaping engines in 67/earlier T-2s. What tools did you use to make the cuts and what are you using for fasteners?
My question about fitting a pancake in there was in regard to using the body lift. I`m still of the impression that it is not neccessary to upright a T-4 engine when going into a Thing if there is a lift installed. As I said before I`m going to do it but it`s just a matter of how much cutting will have to be done.
I was not able to view a cross brace at the rear of the engine. Is there one in place? A lot of people I talk to have the concept that a Kafer Kup Brace will work entirelt satisfactorily. I`m inclined to agree. However in my case it was a small matter to fab up mounts off the bumper mounts. About as cost effective as you can get using a little bit of 3/16" plate.
Again, thanks for sharing with us. Good luck. Bob Ingman

[Bob Ingman]

Dave now that you`ve learned the process will you begin a new post "Posting Photos" and give instructions for those still wishing to do so. Thanks and good luck. Bob Ingman

[LB181]

Dave, Thanks for posting those pictures, your car looks really good. Are your front fenders similar to the Senators car in that they have been trimmed in the front with the headlights mounted to the bumper? Thanks
Corey