Pertronix alert!

[DeathBus]

I tried yesterday to put a Pertronix points replacement on my 412 distributer. this pertronic was for vacuum advance distributers. After taking the points off I tried fitting the magnet portion of the pertronix over the distributer shaft. THE MAGNET DID NOT GO DOWN FAR ENOUGH ON THE DISTRIBUTER SHAFT MAKING THE ROTOR BUTTON NOT SEAT. Be warned if you have a STOCK distributer with fuel injection a pertronix might not work! I tried the same magnent on 3 other vacuum advance distributers that I have and it fit fine.

The particulars on my set up

1973 With stock engine, although it is an engine from a wagon. still has fuel injection.

[vwbill]

Hey D-bus did I read something from "Ray" about having to file them or something but they would work? I know they have a few different letter types I think for the 1847v and L maybe.. I could be way off but on the www.classicgarage.com site they have some dist listed and I think on ebay also...bill

[vwbill]

hey this is from a "Ray" reply..The 205P is the standard 914/411/412 for 1.7. If the coil is still mounted on the hoop attached to the cooling manifold, the short wire one should fit well. There will need to be a very slight filing of onew corner of the module bracket...and slight clearancing on the disc mount for all of this to work properly. Really simple...but let us know when you get it. Ray
sorry I think the other number was 1847VC and has a longer wires..

[raygreenwood]

Yup...thats true too. What that post refers to, is that the bracket for the module mount can and will bump up against either the screw for one of outer partsw coming through the wall...or the dizzy body itself...so be sure the vacuum advance moves the plate all the way.
The next problem is the rotor. On a dremel with a fiberglass cut-off wheel, file the rotor botom about .050". Do this outside and do not breathe the dust. Nasty smell.
Next proble is the slop between the disc and teh cam lobes. Grease the lobe tops and shaft with vaseline. Then put JB weld into the gaps and let it dry to make a better fit. The vaseline keeps it from sticking. Then file it clean on the bottom and you are in business. Ray

[DeathBus]

Hey Ray thanks. But you know, the car has run this long on points, it doesnt bother me to change them out every now and then.

[raygreenwood]

Seriously, ....the points..even the best brand (bluestreak)...adjusted perfectly are no comparison to the smoothness of the pertronix. A lot of the sensitivity of D-jet..and a lot of poor running is caused by poor ignition. Ignition timing perfection is crucial to D-jet. Also, points degrade on the first day of operation. I went pertronix and never went back...huge improvement. Actuallu...I went compufire first, but in my opinion, that kit is not the same quality of harness or bracket as pertronix. The minor mods to the system to use our dizzy were about 30 minutes. Bear this in mind....the stock type 4 is seriously under ignited. The high compression 1.7 FI...even more so. The stock black coil...though excellent...puts out about 18-23,000 volts. After points, resistors, slop, etc....thats about 10-12,000 volts. Problem is....and you can see this....the spark in really small and varies from light blue to pink in teh stock system. No problem in a 7.5:1 compression type 1....but as the mixture gets leaner with FI...and the compression goes up....a surprising amount of fuel is not ignited. A pertronix means almost a full point of CO mixture on an otherwise perfectly adjusted points driven ignition. My new engine when finished..will either use and MSD triggered by pertronix....or possibly Nology wires....which I have installed on others peoples cars with really impressive results.
I installed the pertronix 40,ooo volt coil after running with the just the stock coil and pertronix for about a month. It made a noticable difference...especially at high rpm. The type 4...is underignited by a long shot. Ray

[DeathBus]

Seriously, ....the points..even the best brand (bluestreak)...adjusted perfectly are no comparison to the smoothness of the pertronix. A lot of the sensitivity of D-jet..and a lot of poor running is caused by poor ignition. Ignition timing perfection is crucial to D-jet. Also, points degrade on the first day of operation. I went pertronix and never went back...huge improvement. Actuallu...I went compufire first, but in my opinion, that kit is not the same quality of harness or bracket as pertronix. The minor mods to the system to use our dizzy were about 30 minutes. Bear this in mind....the stock type 4 is seriously under ignited. The high compression 1.7 FI...even more so. The stock black coil...though excellent...puts out about 18-23,000 volts. After points, resistors, slop, etc....thats about 10-12,000 volts. Problem is....and you can see this....the spark in really small and varies from light blue to pink in teh stock system. No problem in a 7.5:1 compression type 1....but as the mixture gets leaner with FI...and the compression goes up....a surprising amount of fuel is not ignited. A pertronix means almost a full point of CO mixture on an otherwise perfectly adjusted points driven ignition. My new engine when finished..will either use and MSD triggered by pertronix....or possibly Nology wires....which I have installed on others peoples cars with really impressive results.
I installed the pertronix 40,ooo volt coil after running with the just the stock coil and pertronix for about a month. It made a noticable difference...especially at high rpm. The type 4...is underignited by a long shot. Ray

Well I run the pertronix in both my Vans, and do like the way the vans run with it, I will probably try the mods for the pertronix. I will also try running the ignitor coil on my vans as well as my sedan. I have heard both sides of the story on the coil though. Just have to try it for myself.

[raygreenwood]

I personnally don't think the pertronix coil was all that high of a quality coil. It is low resistance....but I "think" that after about 5 months, I started seeing a bit of power loss in it. Possibly a heat issue I'm guessing...but it did show that having better voltage made a noticable improvement. Once you make the disc adjustment to the pertronix for best fit...you will never have to do that again. I generally make two rotors....and keep a spare made up in the glove box. I have never had problems with it. Ray

[MGVWfan]

Anyone looked into retrofitting a magnetic trigger unit from a later (WCVW maybe) Bosch distributor? You gotta keep the existing centrifugal and vacuum advance (/retard) systems, as well as the trigger point system for D-Jet, but it's possible the breaker plate from a later electronic distributor with the trigger coil might fit. It depends also on how they attach the trigger rotor, if it can take the place of the breaker cam directly or not.

Certain Hitachi distributors can be retrofitted to electronic by replacement of the breaker plate and trigger rotor, leaving the advance mechanism intact...that's what got me thinking. I installed a modified Hitachi distributor from a 79 Honda Civic in my 67 MGB, it required some mechanical mods to fit, but the benefit was immediately apparent, especially in damp-cold-weather starting. Of course, the original was Lucas, so maybe that's not a fair comparison...