Center link...now what?

ubercrap · Post by **ubercrap** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 2:00 am

How does one remove the pins to start woking on the guts in the ends?

raygreenwood · Post by **raygreenwood** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 5:21 am

Proceed carefully. Try not to damage either the pin....or most especially...the link itself.

You need a dremel tool and a handful of cut-off wheels. Wear goggles. On the "cap" across the back of each joint, you will notice if you inspect closely, that these are indeed simple caps that have had teh steel edge that is part of the link itself....rolled/swaged over the edge. You DO NOT want to damage teh swaged edge. You will need that.
With a cut-off wheen and a steady hand.....cut a slice from side to side....only cutting a fine slot through teh rolled edge...but also cutting a slot all teh way through teh cap.
Turn 90 degrees and make another slot. All the way through teh cap....and out across the swaged/rolled edge. In effect...you just cut the cap into 4 complete wedges. That is why you must conjtinue all the way through the rolled edge woth teh fine slot.....to makesure the cap that is captured underneath is cut as well.

Then pry up the edge of a wedge of teh cap with a screwdriver. Once it is bent upward...grasp it with a pair of vice grips.....wiggle it around and pull it out. Repeat until all four are gone.
Tap the pin with a soft face mallet until it pops out.

Study the the rings and packings. All of it except the pin will go in the trash. You will replace it all with bronze. Get back to us from there. I can send you some snap shots and sketches in e-mail to show you what comes next.

The new caps are easy to make of standard .015" stainless strip available at hobby shops in teh hobby metal section.
That swaged edge wich is till there.....you will widen teh gap unerneath with a cut-off wheel..at low speed....to makew enough clearance for a snap ring and teh new cap. Ray

Single 60 · Post by **Single 60** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 9:11 am

You would be cutting it like a pie is this correct.

Thank You Terry

raygreenwood · Post by **raygreenwood** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 10:34 am

Yep! thats correct. Ray

vwbill · Post by **vwbill** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 11:53 pm

Uber, great post to start! Every 411/412 person will be wanting to see this one through!! Thanks guys! bill

ubercrap · Post by **ubercrap** » Sun Jan 01, 2006 12:39 am

Er, uh, thanks. I don't know if I want to post what it looks like now...but I'll put up some pictures here soon. I cut one of the caps into four pieces, but all I could do is break off the "pie wedge" pieces when trying to work them loose. The "base" part of the pie wedges are still in there...

So, I've just ground off the sharp, mangled edges for now, to save my knuckles. I haven't a clue if I'll be able to get those chunks out now? I'm still not clear as to what is in there exactly.

Also, which direction are the pins supposed to come out? Through where the cap used to be? This pin seems solid as a rock in there! This is uncharted territory for me, and boy do I feel inept right now.

Still, I guess the average schmuck out there isn't rebuilding their own suspension and steering with some custom fabricated/rebuilt parts either... Oh, and before you embark on all this suspension stuff, it would be wise make sure you have some sort of press available I would think. With my limited tools, it has been a severe pain to get some of this stuff apart, and back together- like the idler arm bushing. I got the old one out, but managed to put a dent in the new bushing right on the lip where the pin goes through (bleh, don't ask, my clamping rig slipped out of position)- and still it is only about 2/3 of the way in there right now! Now I know to proceed with only the correct tool for the job.

vwbill · Post by **vwbill** » Sun Jan 01, 2006 1:16 am

So after you cut the top cap that holds the pin in you still have some kinda ridge that is inset in the cup area like the caliper seal area or are you actually cutting the back of the control arm and the pin is set in the cup first then a back plate is pressed on to hold it in place? That sounds more like it! So Ray is saying to cut away the back cover and rebuilding the pin guts and make a new cover plate that sits in the cup cut out area and then is held in place with a "c" clip??? So the pivot pin goes in from the back so there must be a front ridge that the pin rides on then?? You do have to laugh at us 411/412 people and actually rebuilding our suspension componants,lol! Only with the help and creativity of Ray and the crew!! So hey back to the idler bushing! It's a mission to get it in! Are you pressing it in like in a vise or clamp deal or drawing it in with a long bolt and washer setup and tightening the bolt? What way should it be done? I have that mission to do also!! Hey Uber, at least you go for it; that's how you figure stuff out sometimes! bill

ubercrap · Post by **ubercrap** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 12:38 am

Yep, you can get the best information available and prepare, but then you just have to go for it. I was using a clamp to push the idler arm bushing in, but it slipped around so easily, especially since I had some plate scrap I was sandwiching in there. The plate was rough, though, and kind of scraped up the surface of the bushing, but not rough enough to keep it from slipping... I tried putting it in a vice today, but I wasn't confident with this method. I did have the thought at some point of using a big bolt, nut, and washers to pull it together, but for some reason I forgot about it? What the heck is the deal with that?

Maybe it would be best to just have the machine shop next door press it in for me?

raygreenwood · Post by **raygreenwood** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 11:41 am

There is nothing on the pin assembly to break. What is bad in the centerlink assembly is already broken. All of the nylon packings will be swelled up, rusted and crumbling....heliping to wedge the pin into the housing.

The best way to get the cap pieces out...is to take a small thin screwdriver and slightly pry up the flanges that are rolled over it. just pry them up enough to vicegrip the pieces out. Since the centerlink is made of steel....the metal is relatively pliable...unlike cast iron. But try not to pry it back and forth too much.

Once all of the metal is out from the cap....just take a soft face mallet and "whack" the pin out through where you removed the cap. As long as you do not damage the thread on the pin....there is nothing to break.

You can then use a dremel with a fiberglass cut-off wheel, on medium speed (15k pm) to clean out...slightly deepen and make uniform.....the groove where the cap went under the folded over metaledge. Before you do this though....go out and buy a selction of the right diameter internal snap rings....and check the thickness.
But...before you remove anything from the centerlink....measure the length the pin protrudes from the top side. Its not that important....because you will be making your own bushing for between teh idler and pitman arms and the topof the centerlink...,.but having a starting range helps.

If you drop me an e-mail...I can send you pictures of the parts in MGVW's centerlink.....before and after. Looking at what is left of yours...you can easily see what is needed. Ray

ubercrap · Post by **ubercrap** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 8:29 pm

OK, I didn't get very far. I did use the bolt and washer method to get the bronze idler arm bushing in. Took an insane amount of force- I had an 18" piece of pipe on a breaker bar on one side, and a huge piece of pipe on a 15" crescent on the other. I had to stand on the bracket and turn the wrenches with all of my strenth. Basically, it is finally in. There is still probably about .25mm between the top "mushroom" section of the bushing and the bracket, but the bottom of the bushing is flush with the bottom of the bracket. I have no clue how to get it all of the way in, but I don't think it is totally necessary? Overall the bushing is slightly too short, so when the idler arm bottoms out on the larger section of the bolt, there was more play than I was comfortable with. I cut a shim out of some very thin, slick plastic and used it under the bolt head- that is the white in the picture. I don't know if it will hold up, but it is the best I could do.

Center Link: I'll try to see if I can remove the remaining sections of the wedges with the method you describe Ray. Can the pins come out without all of the sections of the cap removed? I hit the pin with a rubber mallet, but all it did was dent the head of the mallet.

vwbill · Post by **vwbill** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 9:00 pm

Hey Uber, what is the gold part between the top and the idler body? Is that the bronze type bushing? The stock one looks so different! So what kinda top lip does the bronze one have? The stock one looked like a thin top lip? I guess that thing is in, if it toke that much force to get it to that point! So that washer/spacer you made is between the bolt that goes through the bushing? Is there a cap on the bolt? It looks like it is domed shaped? How does the bolt feel in the bronze bushing when you move the arm? So is the bronze bushing all bronze? Sounds like you need some kinda hydralic setup to get the bushing in like maybe a piston jack or maybe that's one for the mechine shop guys! LOL! Thanks for the pic posts! bill
p.s. Can you put a piece of hose over the treads and then hit the pin? Would the hose wedge to protect the treads up on the tapper and if you cut it long protect the head and can razor cut it off?

ubercrap · Post by **ubercrap** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 10:26 pm

Yep, that is the bronze bushing- totally solid. The top part is indeed slightly thicker than stock overall. However, the stock bushing has the center protruding further than the rest, while this is just one uniform thickness, so it looks much thicker, when the difference is only slight. I filed some off of it, but it probably could use more ideally. The head of the bolt at the bottom of the picture takes a large allen wrench, that's why it looks smooth. That is where I put the plastic shim in. The other end is a 19mm nut. The bolt fits just fine in the bushing.

raygreenwood · Post by **raygreenwood** » Tue Jan 03, 2006 5:11 am

If I were you...I would carefully press that bushing back out. There is a chance...that the radius at the area where the tube joins the mushroom head...is not clean enough and that is why the bushing is not seating all the way. My bushing went in with just prerssure from a vise. It also has slightly thinner flange....but that should be no big deal.

The plastic washer up top will be a mistake. It will wallow out almost instantly, and give you the same slop you worked so hard to get rid of. Its not normal for the bushing to be a little short from the top but it should be no problem. There needs to be a washer there if the bushing tube is short. If the bushing does not go all the way to the top then the bolt may start wearing on the aluminum of the bracket. The easy way to fix this...is simply to go to the hardware store and buy some bronze bushings, washers or rod and use them to make up the difference at the top...or just use a bronze washer in the place of that plastic one and you should be fine.
The only thing that may be caused by teh flange being too thick...is misalignment of the pin from the centerlink if the idler arm dips too low. Ray

ubercrap · Post by **ubercrap** » Tue Jan 03, 2006 1:46 pm

Yep, good idea, I'll replace the washer I made with a metal one. I just have to find something thin enough. The reason I can't get the bushing in there any further is because the bottom (the top really, when it is in the car) is already flush with the bracket, hence, clamping it any further would just be compressing the bushing itself. The stock bushing did stick out from the housing a bit on that end IIRC...Not sure how one is supposed to push it in past the housing while clamping...All in all, I think it will still work OK once I get a better washer/shim in there.

I'm still trying to get a handle on the center link...

MGVWfan · Post by **MGVWfan** » Tue Jan 17, 2006 8:44 am

I used the Meyle "stock type" bonded rubber bushing due to the press of time, and I am getting a slight bit of slop at the idler bushing already after about 1000 miles on the road.

Ray's 100% right on this one, DEFINITELY use that solid bushing at the idler like Uber. I'll be going back in and retrofitting one after I finish with the Duster.

BTW, I had to use a brake hone on the ID of the idler arm bracket to knock down some skived-up lumps from removing the original bushing. Before I did that, I couldn't get the bushing to go down in the bracket. Just a few passes with the hone in the drill, and it was back to a moderate press fit (instead of unfittable even with lots of pressure).