VW Automuseum

Discuss with fans and owners of the most luxurious aircooled sedan/wagon that VW ever made, the VW 411/412. Official forum of Tom's Type 4 Corner.
412s2
Posts: 126
Joined: Sun Jul 08, 2007 3:09 am

VW Automuseum

Post by 412s2 »

Thought you might like to see some pictures I took whilst visiting the VW Automuseum in Wolfsburg a couple of months ago. Firstly I must apologise for their quality, I was in a bit of a panic as my battery was running low and so they were taken in a bit of a rush... Click on any picture to make it bigger!

Here you can see the Type 4 prototypes lined up. It was interesting to see the little differences that didn't make it into production. Both Type 4s didn't have the strengthening rib in the middle of the floor at the very front for example.
Image Image Image Image
This 1966 prototype has lots of differences from the production Type 4 but is clearly related. Volkswagen call it a 'Special 311' and it was intended to replace the Type 3, this design was stopped in favour of a transverse engined front wheel drive machine, which was in turn canceled in favour of a modified fastback Audi 80. The car in the pictures is fitted with an early Type 4 engine displacing 1493cc and producing 58PS.
Image Image Image Image
The fuel tank is mounted in front of the rear suspension and the rear trailing arms do not have pick-up points for the rear anti-roll bar
Image
The front suspension arms look very different! It's in pretty poor condition and as you can see, it's missing its front springs...
Image
This is an technically interesting design that I think would have made a good little brother for the Type 4. It was to be known as the Volkswagen 191 and was designed by Porsche, Ferdinand Piech was in charge of the project whilst he was working there. It is fitted with a mid-mounted, watercooled, OHC, oversquare, inline 4. From what I have read, the first pre-production run of 50 vehicles had been produced when Rudolf Leiding took over as chairman of the VW board and scrapped the whole project in favour of the Golf. Volkswagen must have been hemorrhaging money at this point! The model pictured here is fitted with an 1588cc engine producing 80PS on carbs, there was also a fuel injected model developed that produced 105PS. The car weighs only 745kg!
Image Image
Front suspension
Image
Steering rack, it has a VW badge and the part number 191 415 107 cast into it.
Image
Looking from the right rear. The engine is mounted longitudinally on its side with the radiator and fan mounted to the right of the sump.
Image
Looking towards the rear from the left hand rear wheel. Here you can see the airbox, with the carburettor above it and the cam cover to the left of the picture. It has a diagonal trailing arm rear axle. The engine is sited under the rear seat; I can just imagine how difficult this car would be to work on and that airbox is incredibly exposed!
Image
This is the ESVW 1 and was developed from the Type 4. It possibly shows us how the Type 4 might have developed if they had stuck with the concept.
Image
The interior. There are 2 levers on the centre console, one for the automatic gearbox and another one marked brakes! No idea what that lever does! I can tell you the car was fitted with internally ventilated disc brakes all round, clamped by floating calipers and controlled by an ABS system!
Image
This car was built in 1971, but the front suspension set up looks very similar to the Golfs! The steering is rack and pinion and automatically corrects for a sidewind!
Image
It is fitted with a fuel injected 1.8 developing 100ps, the rear trailing arms are not the same as the Type 4's
Image
Image
I like the fire service 412
Image

If you ever get to Wolfsburg, the Automuseum on Dieselstrasse is definitely well worth a visit. I wish they would have displayed a bit more information about the cars, the designers behind them and maybe some videos or pictures of testing and development of the cars. Autostadt is amazing for its architecture and the beautiful people working there, but I actually found it a little creepy as it all seems just a little too perfect with not a blade of grass out of place and the gravel raked into concentric circles!!! It reminded my friends and I of the film Gattaca! Other than that and the interesting cars in the ZeitHaus museum, it was just like an extravagant, shiny sales brochure for modern VW group cars and overall left us all feeling a little flat.
User avatar
Wally
Posts: 4563
Joined: Mon Oct 28, 2002 12:01 am

Post by Wally »

:shock:
Very cool pictures!!
I really like the underside pics! Thanks for taking the time to post these here!

Did you also find the 6 cylinder 'type 4' there?
EA166 it was called IIRC :?:
T4T: 2,4ltr Type 4 Turbo engine, 10.58 1/4 mi
www.apfelbeck.nl
"Mine isn't turbo'd to make a slow engine fast, but to make a fast engine insane" - Chip Birks
User avatar
Lars S
Posts: 321
Joined: Sat Jul 07, 2007 12:25 pm

Post by Lars S »

Yes thank you 412s2, this was of great value to me!


Lars S
-914/4 -72 daily driver
-Husqvarna 120cc rat bike -48
-Husqvarna 120cc -52
-BMW 600 Road Scrambler -69
-Suzuki T500 Cobra -69
-VW411LE 2-door sedan -70
-Porsche 914/4 -72
-VW412LE 4-door sedan -73
-Suzuki K50 -77
412s2
Posts: 126
Joined: Sun Jul 08, 2007 3:09 am

Post by 412s2 »

Hi, I'm glad you liked the pictures. I've always been more interested in how a car works than how it looks, that's why I took so many pictures from underneath! Although I have seen pictures of these cars in various VW books and on the net, I've never seen any pictures of their oily bits! I only wish I was able to have spent more time there, got them up on a ramp and opened some doors and engine compartments!!

Sadly neither of the flat-6 'Type 4s', ea128, were on display at the time of my visit :( I guess I'll have to wait until my next visit. I also wanted a good look at the prototype 4-wheel drive Type 2 Westfalia that was built in the '70s, but it wasn't there either...

I find the late '60s and early '70s to be a fascinating period in VW's history, with lots of strange engineering concepts being considered for production, like the mid engined VW 191. I've also read that they had built a stratified charge air-cooled flat-4 and stratified charge Wankel rotary. Unfortunately none of these project are on display at the museum.

Here are some more pictures you might find interesting...

Under the 411 notchback
Image
Some more pictures of the Porsche designed VW 191 (aka ea266) As you might have guessed I was a little fascinated by how this car works! I don't think any other manufacturer has made a mid-engined, family hatchback...?
Image
This is taken from in front of the right, rear wheel, looking towards the left, rear wheel. You can see the bottom of the radiator, what I think is the fan housing with some bodge tape hanging from it, also what looks like the water pump with maybe a mechanical fuel pump above it (the gold coloured thing)?
Image
This picture was taken from under the gearbox and is looking forward. Again you can see the radiator and fan housing on the right hand side. Moving left, you can see the oil filter, clutch release mechanism, the handbrake cables are held in place by guides on the oil sump pan; and that tube on the left hand side of the picture is the gear selection rod. Did you notice that on this car the differential is mounted at the very rear of the car, with the gearbox between it and the engine, unlike the VW-Porsche 914? The main engine block appears to be painted red, I have no idea what it is made of, I only know it was mounted on its side...
Image
This 1957 prototype is apparently the great granddaddy of the Type 4. It's called ea53 and was developed by Porsche. It has a rear mounted air-cooled flat-4 displacing 887cc and producing 32.5PS. Notice the exhaust exiting from the top of the cylinder head? I think it was the first VW prototype that has unitary construction. From what I have read it wasn't a very successful design as its swing axle rear suspension caused problems in testing, so development of this model was stopped and VW started again with ea142 in 1962. Ea142 was the first prototype with the double jointed rear axle and semi-trailing arms... Unfortunately the 1962 prototype wasn't on display :(
Image Image
vwbill
Posts: 970
Joined: Sat Feb 15, 2003 12:01 am

Great PIcture!

Post by vwbill »

Thanks for the pictures! It looks like a great place to visit! Too bad they didn't have more 412 stuff out!! I have to say I feel better about how my car gets rust from sitting after seeing they have the same issue with keeping their cars maintained from moisture!! Thanks again! Bill
User avatar
Lars S
Posts: 321
Joined: Sat Jul 07, 2007 12:25 pm

Post by Lars S »

To me the ESVW looks more modern than almost any car from that time (except perhaps the NSU RO80 ). The design could wery well be from the 80's or 90's.
The dashboard looks as a forerunner to the Golf's one. Sorry they did not realize the ideas fully out...


Lars
-914/4 -72 daily driver
-Husqvarna 120cc rat bike -48
-Husqvarna 120cc -52
-BMW 600 Road Scrambler -69
-Suzuki T500 Cobra -69
-VW411LE 2-door sedan -70
-Porsche 914/4 -72
-VW412LE 4-door sedan -73
-Suzuki K50 -77
User avatar
ubercrap
Posts: 1394
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2004 8:00 pm

Post by ubercrap »

Lars S wrote:To me the ESVW looks more modern than almost any car from that time (except perhaps the NSU RO80 ). The design could wery well be from the 80's or 90's.
The dashboard looks as a forerunner to the Golf's one. Sorry they did not realize the ideas fully out...


Lars
Not only could one compare it on just the level of design advancement, it very much resembles the actual design of the Ro80. VW bought NSU in 1969, I believe, so that makes sense. Sadly, the last NSU Ro80 I saw for sale in the U.S. had been "faux vandalized" for the set of a Christina Aguilera music video... :(
User avatar
Lars S
Posts: 321
Joined: Sat Jul 07, 2007 12:25 pm

Post by Lars S »

No, I know, this is no NSU forum but the item is quite close to the 411 and when looking at the RO80...

Image

...who could believe that this car was designed 63 to 66?
-914/4 -72 daily driver
-Husqvarna 120cc rat bike -48
-Husqvarna 120cc -52
-BMW 600 Road Scrambler -69
-Suzuki T500 Cobra -69
-VW411LE 2-door sedan -70
-Porsche 914/4 -72
-VW412LE 4-door sedan -73
-Suzuki K50 -77
Post Reply