412 clubstand on KWF

Wally · Post by **Wally** » Sun Jan 06, 2008 11:17 am

Hope this time no time-out occurs..

Wally · Post by **Wally** » Sun Jan 06, 2008 11:54 am

Huge '68 411 model that used to belong to the factory

:

And shot especially for Bill: worked open D-jetronic:

Wally · Post by **Wally** » Sun Jan 06, 2008 12:12 pm

And some better pics made by Ton:

Bill K. · Post by **Bill K.** » Sun Jan 06, 2008 12:14 pm

Nice looking cars. What was the event?

Thanks for the DJet picture. That makes it look so SIMPLE

Interesting plenum and throttle body...

Wally · Post by **Wally** » Sun Jan 06, 2008 12:34 pm

Its the yearly indoor aircooled vw happening: www.keverwinterfestijn.nl

Ton send me two more. The '68 white 2-door automatic is freshly restored and extremely nice:

Ton's car is the green 411 in the foreground. My favorite was the blue metallic 412- 4-door:

Both blue and white car were awarded with a top 10 show award price

Wally · Post by **Wally** » Sun Jan 06, 2008 12:41 pm

This one parked outside, also a '74 model:

I had to park outside as well

SureFit Travis · Post by **SureFit Travis** » Sun Jan 06, 2008 1:23 pm

That is a really well put-together display. I've never seen more than one type-4 at a VW car show at one time.

I'm assuming that the '68 automatic car was a conversion by-owner.....or was this a prototype as well?

Super-cool D-jet display.....even if it is type-3!

Thanks for posting these pics.

Travis

tuna · Post by **tuna** » Mon Jan 07, 2008 2:23 pm

Thanks for the photos!! Oh wow, I don't think you'd ever see such a display like that here in the USA.

We are too Bus/Bug/KG centered over here....

I like the small replica in the middle. Is that a model or a toy? I'd love to have one for my collection.

Thanks again for sharing!!

Tuna

Wally · Post by **Wally** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 4:56 am

tuna wrote:Thanks for the photos!! Oh wow, I don't think you'd ever see such a display like that here in the USA. We are too Bus/Bug/KG centered over here....

And then to think that the 412 club in itself is very small, especially compared to other vw clubs!

I like the small replica in the middle. Is that a model or a toy? I'd love to have one for my collection.

Thanks again for sharing!!

Tuna

Its actually a unique specimen, which is well over a foot in size!
It actually belonged once to the VW Factory plant who made the type 4. I heard it was made around the time the 411 was launched, so its probably 40 years old by now

Don't know myself how they gained possesion, but I'am sure I'll hear that story one day. The most active members of that club are indeed a very remarkable group in their achievements and activities i've noticed so far

Your welcome of course

Lahti411 · Post by **Lahti411** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 1:51 pm

Here's more info about the design model:
http://www.type4.org/history/proto_designmodel.html

Sure Fit Travis, why do you think the '68 model is a conversion? At least my dealer advertisments from the august '68 shows, such model was available back then.

SureFit Travis · Post by **SureFit Travis** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 10:34 pm

Lahti411:

My question refers to the automatic transmission in this car.....so far, most of what I have read tells me that all 2-door models came equipped from the factory as 4-speed manual transmission cars only.

So, my curiousity is whether this was a factory automatic car (and if what I have read so far has been inaccurate)...perhaps even a prototype (afterall, this was the first year of the type-4 line)....or if the car was converted by-owner from 4-speed to automatic....which is not at all impossible. I do believe I have read references to other owners doing transaxle conversions.

So, yeah, I read the caption that the car was an automatic, and thought 'Wow, I thought the 2-doors were all 4-speed cars from the factory.' Then I wondered if this was a North-American-market-only quirk. Again, most literature tells us that the 411/412's sold in the U.S. as wagon and 4-door models were equipped with automatics only.....but my first type 4 (a dark green '71 411 wagon) had the 4-speed manual. Then again, I live in Canada.

Travis

Lahti411 · Post by **Lahti411** » Wed Jan 09, 2008 4:24 am

Yeah, I thought that was the issue: automatic transmission.

Here in Europe all of these cars were equipped with manual transmission as standard and the automatic transmission was offered as an option for each body type, including the two-door.

In general cars with auto-trans are much more rare here than those with manual trans. In fact I have never seen an auto-box type 4 here in Finland, no matter which body type, because these were expencive cars and automatic transmission would have made the price even higher.

raygreenwood · Post by **raygreenwood** » Wed Jan 09, 2008 7:33 am

Its also worth it to remember that the idea of one transmission or another as an option was built into the car from the beginning.
In all type 4's....2 door, 4 door and wagon.....all of the drillings, holes, mounts and threads to use either transmission are installed on the assembly line. To further add options the embossings for the power brake location and for right hand drive are also already in the chassis. To use either one of the afore mentioned options....would be a simple matter of using a hydraulic hand held knockout device (like for electrical box knockouts) on the assembly line to very quickly install either power brakes or right hand drive. Ray

Lars S · Post by **Lars S** » Wed Jan 09, 2008 7:49 am

I was also doubful if the automatic was an option for the early 411's but the "Bible" "Die grossen VW" (ISBN 3-9803665-0-2
http://www.karl-goerner.de/vw.htm) tells that there was an auto-option from the beginning.

(Great exhibition stand!!!)

Lars

Lars S · Post by **Lars S** » Wed Jan 09, 2008 8:04 am

..and remarkably the automatic was not available for the 411E until its second year (1971) until then only available for the 68hp engine...

Lars