A 412 on a rolling road dyno

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Wally
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A 412 on a rolling road dyno

Post by Wally »

This must be a first. Ever seen a VW412 on a dyno? 8)

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Laptop on front seat to calibrate rpm input with dyno software:
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The run:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V0GCl9ldPLs

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Result was 113 hp at 5100 rpm, but tranny losses were taken a bit high (20%); at 15-18% loss power would be 108-110 fwhp :D
Its a almost stock 914 2.0 engine with efi instead of D-jetronic

Walter
T4T: 2,4ltr Type 4 Turbo engine, 10.58 1/4 mi
www.apfelbeck.nl
"Mine isn't turbo'd to make a slow engine fast, but to make a fast engine insane" - Chip Birks
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raygreenwood
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Post by raygreenwood »

Nice!
I have had my 412 on the chassis dyno several times. Sadly...never for tuning....for emmissions only and once just for measurement ofwhat I was putting out but no tuning time. In Texas they use a very similra dyno for emmissosn check. Keep up the good work! Ray
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Bill K.
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Re: A 412 on a rolling road dyno

Post by Bill K. »

Wally wrote:Result was 113 hp at 5100 rpm, but tranny losses were taken a bit high (20%); at 15-18% loss power would be 108-110 fwhp :D
Nice numbers and pictures! The chart has been converted to flywheel hp using 20% trans loss when wheel hp is measured?

How many runs did it take to dial in? What did you change? Do you have more plots showing effects?
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Wally
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Re: A 412 on a rolling road dyno

Post by Wally »

Bill K. wrote:
Wally wrote:Result was 113 hp at 5100 rpm, but tranny losses were taken a bit high (20%); at 15-18% loss power would be 108-110 fwhp :D
Nice numbers and pictures! The chart has been converted to flywheel hp using 20% trans loss when wheel hp is measured?
The RWHP was 93.7 so my conclusion was as stated above :wink:
How many runs did it take to dial in? What did you change? Do you have more plots showing effects?
It was basically one run. I had a pretty good advance map (imo) from the 2056cc I ran in the bug for a short time and been logging AFR and running closed loop last week, so I had the AFR dialled in pretty well also. The AFR at WOT did only take 2 or 3 runs on the street, as that part of the map is the most easy to dial in, especially if you don't have very much power (saftety and running out of 'runway' is much less :lol: ).
I did one other run with 2 degrees more advance (31 instead of 29 for the most part) and I dunno what happend, but we got 20 hp less over the whole rpm band :shock: , except at 1500-1750 rpm, where a slight increase in torque was noticed...
That seemed almost a flaw or something, so I putted the original advance back and the previous numbers were back again. Can hardly believe that 2 degrees would make such a large difference.

The wild lambda values in the plot are weird too, as my own readings from the LM1 were almost dead steady 12.5 to 12.8 AFR all across the rpm band while doing a WOT run on the street (highway). recorded it on the log as well. Also the first run on the dyno when my LM1 log was still running (wideband attached to in-car LM1) showed this steady AFR of 12.5-12.8. I corrected it a bit up top so 12.8 would be more 12.5 and we got about 1 hp extra :lol: The dyno is that accurate :wink:
So, difficult to say which lambda was reading correct. We switched connections on the plug from the 5-wire bosche sensor loom, so the same sensor was used, just a different processing in the dyno box I guess. I tend to believe my LM1 box over the dyno-cell box, but you never know. I will calibrate the sensor later this week again in clean air to rule that out (its been a while since the last calibration).

Also because cost-wise I only did a powerrun as you pay the dyno by the hour if you start mapping on the dyno and it adds up quick. A good idea if you can't map your car on the street, but with this ecu you can do most on the street while driving along :wink:

It would be interesting to know - assuming afr is steady and good all the way - where the dip at 3300 rpm comes from..?

Hope that answers your q?
T4T: 2,4ltr Type 4 Turbo engine, 10.58 1/4 mi
www.apfelbeck.nl
"Mine isn't turbo'd to make a slow engine fast, but to make a fast engine insane" - Chip Birks
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raygreenwood
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Post by raygreenwood »

Wally, is your enrichment method partly governed by vacuum (vacuum indexed fuel pressure regulator)? If so, it would be nice to see indexed fuel pressure or vacuum signature alongside that graph at 3500 rpm. That might be a source of the dip. Its common on factory cars. Of course....if that issue is consistent, you may simply be able to program in an rpm related pulse width adjustment. Ray
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Wally
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Post by Wally »

raygreenwood wrote:Wally, is your enrichment method partly governed by vacuum (vacuum indexed fuel pressure regulator)?
Ray
No, it isn't. Enrichment is enabled from a certain change in throttle position (also a variable you can fill out 0-100%) during a certain amount of crank rotations (also to be filled out) by a certain percentage of fuel adding (you fill out 0-100%) .

The dip in the graph I explained in the post above (hope I was clear enough, lemme know if not) :wink:
T4T: 2,4ltr Type 4 Turbo engine, 10.58 1/4 mi
www.apfelbeck.nl
"Mine isn't turbo'd to make a slow engine fast, but to make a fast engine insane" - Chip Birks
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Wally
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Post by Wally »

I installed my Pauter set today on the 2 ltr in the 412.
The 412 does not have the big dry-sump pump that the bug had (26/38mm), but only the smaller (21/26mm) Schadeck CB DS-pump.
Hope it will work... and if power is better (?)..
T4T: 2,4ltr Type 4 Turbo engine, 10.58 1/4 mi
www.apfelbeck.nl
"Mine isn't turbo'd to make a slow engine fast, but to make a fast engine insane" - Chip Birks
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raygreenwood
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Post by raygreenwood »

Coooool!
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Wally
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Post by Wally »

Drove 60 miles to work and back today and engine still lives 8)
The better breathing IS noticeble :D
T4T: 2,4ltr Type 4 Turbo engine, 10.58 1/4 mi
www.apfelbeck.nl
"Mine isn't turbo'd to make a slow engine fast, but to make a fast engine insane" - Chip Birks
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vwfye
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Post by vwfye »

nice! i have to admit, i wish my car (same color) would shine like that!
Notchback mid-engine speedster
Little Giant Killer 3
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