4 lug drums on link pin spindles

[bikesndbugs]

so im planning on swapping from ball joint to link pin and want to keep the 4 lug drums because they are wider so more braking area for better stopping and i recently replaced most of the parts in them. Ive heard that the conversion bearings to run cheap ball joint rotors on link pin but ive heard they also wont work. Ive also heard they wont work so will they or not. these are the right ones right?
Would i use link pin or ball joint backing plates because i have both.
http://www.socalautoparts.com/product_i ... rs-p-16935
http://www.socalautoparts.com/product_i ... rs-p-16936

[Ol'fogasaurus]

You needed to read down farther: "These wheel bearings from EMPI are designed to adapt early style link pin spindles to late style ball joint rotors." You were talking about using drum brakes.

I don't think, but I don't know for certain, that there are direct wheel bearings to put the larger diameter (BJ spindles) bearings onto the smaller diameter K&L spindles.

There are other options but not continuing to use the four lug drum brakes.

Lee

[bikesndbugs]

ya i could just buy 5 lug drums but id need new shoes and such. Are the rotors and drums berrings not the same? I would assume they are the same because with other bearings it shows them being for both drum and rotors

[Ol'fogasaurus]

Sorry, I don't know for sure. If I gave an answer I would only be guessing.

I doubt they would add a "disclaimer" like that without good reason though but I don't know the why. Too many variables involved such as the bearings use in stock VW rotors vs. aftermarket designed rotors and so on.

Marc, Piledriver or some others might know for sure.

Lee

[Chip Birks]

You should be just fine using the adaptor bearings. The differences between disc brake spindles and drum brake spindles are the backing plate/caliper mounts, not the actual spindle itself. I'm currently running B/J rotors on L/P drum spindles using that set of bearings. I couldn't tell you if B/J vs L/P backing plates are the same though.

[Ol'fogasaurus]

The more I thought about it the more interesting your question got. I did a search on what you asked and got this, which I have seen before. If what they say here, you need to change spindles to the Ghia spindles, I found interesting that the spindle might be some or all of the reason between the bearing question you asked.

“A great "stock" VW conversion for Type 1 Bug with a balljoint front end (4 lug) is to use parts for/from a VW Karmann Ghia with a ball joint frontend(sic). You will need to remove the stock spindles on the Type 1 you are converting and install the disc brake spindles, calipers, rotors and brake pads for a Karmann Ghia. A simple alignment adjustment and break bleed is the only thing else that is needed. (http://vw.zenseeker.net/Brakes.htm)

His opinion and I personally don't know if it is the right answer or not but it was about the only real thing I found doing the search. The (sic) was put there as this is what he said in that sentence but the next sentence I highlighted clarified the point... I think.

Lee

[dave46]

Appletree Automotive lists the conversion bearings
http://www.appletreeauto.com/K-P-CONV-B ... 17-2795-0/

[Ol'fogasaurus]

Good to hear that there is now something that works. I looked into it back in the early '90s when I was still running brakes and thinking about changing beams until I found out how much work it would be. The adapter bearings and the time, as I remember, had a rep that they didn't fit right.

Didn't the guy from Appletree used to post here at one time?

Lee

[no1clyde]

When I built my yellow tube frame buggy I used type 3 rotors and calipers with the caliper adapters from Appeltree and their bearings too on link pin spindles and it worked great so when I built my Baja I took those brakes off the buggy and put them on the Baja and I then put a set of those same bearings in my 4 lug drums and put link pin backing plates and shoes on and it worked ok but it seemed the if I would have spaced the backing plate out 1/8" it would have worked better but after I put combo spindles on my Baja the buggy got it's discs back but the drums work fine for almost a year.

Ed

[bikesndbugs]

When I built my yellow tube frame buggy I used type 3 rotors and calipers with the caliper adapters from Appeltree and their bearings too on link pin spindles and it worked great so when I built my Baja I took those brakes off the buggy and put them on the Baja and I then put a set of those same bearings in my 4 lug drums and put link pin backing plates and shoes on and it worked ok but it seemed the if I would have spaced the backing plate out 1/8" it would have worked better but after I put combo spindles on my Baja the buggy got it's discs back but the drums work fine for almost a year.

Ed

Ok nice so it will work with drums hopefully i can use the ball joint shoes and whatever backing plates will work

[no1clyde]

You can use the BJ shoes but you need link pin backing plates.

Ed

[Marc]

so im planning on swapping from ball joint to link pin and want to keep the 4 lug drums because they are wider so more braking area for better stopping and i recently replaced most of the parts in them. ...i could just buy 5 lug drums but id need new shoes and such...

Front brake shoes and wheel cylinders have been the same size since 1958; the only change was to wider slots and angled-end shoe frames (with matching angled-slot adjusters) in 1965.

So, you can use any `58-`65 K&L front drums, bearings, & backing plates and run the shoes, adjusters and wheel cylinders from your 4-lug brakes.

[sideshow]

This peaks my interest as I have more good 4-lug drums/rims/tires and k&l roller/projects.
Is the there a non-EMPI source for this?

[jps1145]

Still don't think there are conversion bearings to mount 4-lug drums to K/L spindles.

[Chip Birks]

Still don't think there are conversion bearings to mount 4-lug drums to K/L spindles.

Why not? What's the difference between a bj drum bearing and a bj disk bearing?