I'm stuck. I got the correct seal for my 1970 bus, took out the window, repaired the rust, and now I can't get the window back in.
It sounds stuipd, but the method other VW people have told me to use, i.e. the wire to pull the seal in, was completely inneffective. It only pulls the seal half way in at best, then when pressure is applied to any part, the other side pops out. So i tried putting pressure on both sides at once, then it just wont budge. The seal does look a bit bigger than the original which had the moulding groove.
After being out there for an hour I came in and called every auto glass place in the phone book and all of them said they wouldnt do it.
What am I missing here?
Bay Window Bus Window seal AHHHHH!
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Super74
- Posts: 107
- Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2001 12:01 am
Bay Window Bus Window seal AHHHHH!
I'll soon remove my window to do the same rust repair (as well as paint the entire Bus!) so I'll be interested to find out how this problem turns out. I read somewhere..I think Bus Depot sells the front seal that extends a little lower on the bottom to conceal rust repair. Not that I will have to conceal anything, but I was thinking of buying it. Anyone have experience with this seal?
Also, where can I find a vent window frame. It's for a '74 Bus, sliding door window w/vent. The cancer got it pretty bad.
Also, where can I find a vent window frame. It's for a '74 Bus, sliding door window w/vent. The cancer got it pretty bad.
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76type2
- Posts: 3
- Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2001 12:01 am
Bay Window Bus Window seal AHHHHH!
Hey guys. Done this window thing several times. You have the right idea BUT, You really need 2 people for a windshield. What I do is have one person on the outside applying pressure and GENTLY slapping the window with an open hand (remove any jewelry) while I pull the cord. I use very small rope or heavy twine. I lube the frame with WD-40 or Dawn dishsoap mixed with water, As I pull the rope in I ask the pressure person to retain pressure on one end while slapping, remember gently, on the area where the rope is pulling the seal in. It's a 15 minute ordeal but you need patience. Hope this helps, Dj
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76type2
- Posts: 3
- Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2001 12:01 am
Bay Window Bus Window seal AHHHHH!
Hey SUPER74,
What part are you loking for from a 74 Bus? I have one of the crank out windows from a 74. Is this what you need? or are you looking for the swingout vent window? I have one of those too. Talk to me. Dj
What part are you loking for from a 74 Bus? I have one of the crank out windows from a 74. Is this what you need? or are you looking for the swingout vent window? I have one of those too. Talk to me. Dj
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rich2481
- Posts: 1539
- Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2001 12:01 am
Bay Window Bus Window seal AHHHHH!
I would not tap it if the window has not been prepped with a sander on the edge, the window could crack, Never done a bus window but I put sunflower seed oil on the seal before i put it in ( in the groove) it also helps to find a string that is big enough to spread the seal slightly, put the bottom in first ( 2 person job) and go half up one side and then half on the other, Helps to get the seal warm in dryer first or hot water,and do on a sunny day. work both side evenly and stop if rope pulls out of seal, ( I also have a nylon tool for changing bike tubes ground down to fit the groove) use a angle that pulls the lip way out ( towards the glass, takes some getting used to working together but after your first window it will be a breeze. i have the outside person use their hand and rub towards the edge, have to clean window alot to get oil off and get friction to pull it a glass plunger can help pull the window though ( I use rubber coated rope pretty small with two dowels to roll rope up and give me some grip to pull )
good luck
[This message has been edited by rich2481 (edited 02-13-2002).]
[This message has been edited by rich2481 (edited 02-13-2002).]
good luck
[This message has been edited by rich2481 (edited 02-13-2002).]
[This message has been edited by rich2481 (edited 02-13-2002).]
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Pillow
- Posts: 2940
- Joined: Mon Oct 15, 2001 1:01 am
Bay Window Bus Window seal AHHHHH!
2 people are mandatory. I like regular automotive wire becuase it is big enough to open the chanel up and ver pliable.
PITA but it is worth it
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Adrian Pillow
'66 VW Westfalia - "Biscuit"
'79 Porsche 911 SC - "Cochese"
PITA but it is worth it
------------------
Adrian Pillow
'66 VW Westfalia - "Biscuit"
'79 Porsche 911 SC - "Cochese"
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SuperBeetle71
- Posts: 636
- Joined: Tue Jul 18, 2000 12:01 am
Bay Window Bus Window seal AHHHHH!
I did use 2 people. I think my brother and I ended up slapping each other more than the glass. It seems like maybe 3 are necessary heh.
I look at it, and it doesnt seem possible that it would fit. The new seal is about 1/4 inch bigger than the old one.
[This message has been edited by SuperBeetle71 (edited 02-13-2002).]
I look at it, and it doesnt seem possible that it would fit. The new seal is about 1/4 inch bigger than the old one.
[This message has been edited by SuperBeetle71 (edited 02-13-2002).]
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Super74
- Posts: 107
- Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2001 12:01 am
Bay Window Bus Window seal AHHHHH!
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 76type2:
<B>Hey SUPER74,
What part are you loking for from a 74 Bus? I have one of the crank out windows from a 74. Is this what you need? or are you looking for the swingout vent window? I have one of those too. Talk to me. Dj</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
76type2,
I just sent you an e-mail. It's the swingout vent window. Thanks
<B>Hey SUPER74,
What part are you loking for from a 74 Bus? I have one of the crank out windows from a 74. Is this what you need? or are you looking for the swingout vent window? I have one of those too. Talk to me. Dj</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
76type2,
I just sent you an e-mail. It's the swingout vent window. Thanks
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Derek May
- Posts: 217
- Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2001 1:01 am
Bay Window Bus Window seal AHHHHH!
SuperB:
I did this last year, and it is truly a PITA no matter how you do it.
The factory seal didn't use any butyl sealant, but most installers will put some in, it seals better. I had mine in and took it out because it leaked like crazy with no sealant.
I'm going to be flamed for suggesting this, but will say so anyways.
Get some old fashioned windshield sealant, it Butyl, the stuff that never goes hard. Put some in the groove the window goes into, not too much. Shove the window in the grove. That alone isn't easy to do.
Put some cord in the seal, where its supposed to meet with the metal.
place the windshield into the opening, fiddling and jigging until its in the just right place.
Inject some goop in a light bead around the seal. Do this at this time so you aren't getting goop all over the lip you are trying to bring into the Van, over the metal edging.
Play whack-a-mole all around the edge of the glass. Use you hand, its pretty strong glass. I'm not recommending this, because I'm not responsible if it doesn't work, but I took a stub of lumber (2x6, about 8 inchels long) and wrapped the end in a towel, placed it against the glass and hit it with a hammer at a certain point. Hitting the seal didn't do much, was necessary to hit the glass. Whacking with bare hands didn't move the glass enough. Window didn't break or crack, and I wouldn't have got it in without this technique.
bump, whack and do what's necessary until the seal is pushed against the metal lip. Don't start pulling on the cord until you are there.
At this point, the butyl goop will start acting like a lubricant, and make things a little easier, and it will also seal things up when done, two benefits.
Carefully pull the cord while the outside guy is whacking and pushing at the same place you are pulling, it needs to seal as you go, its not going to magically "pop" in place, you really have to shove it in, bit by bit.
There may be a best place to start the process, I believe I started in a lower corner, and worked my way up, then worked both the top and the bottom across.
If and when you finally have it in place, the seal is going to look like hell, because its too much on the glass, and isn't going to be in the opening. You'll see from where the clean metal is from under the old seal. Get yourself a length of lumber, 2x6 is good, not too small you want to spread out the impact. Wrap it in a rag or towel you can throw away, and hold it parallel to the window, end against the seal, and start whacking the seal into place, gently around and around and around. Whack just hard enough to make things move, and you'll eventually get the seal placed appropriately.
Figured on an hour, took all day.
To anyone who recommendes against Buytl goop .. two questions:
1) ever done this?
2) did it leak without the goop?
Goodluck.
I did this last year, and it is truly a PITA no matter how you do it.
The factory seal didn't use any butyl sealant, but most installers will put some in, it seals better. I had mine in and took it out because it leaked like crazy with no sealant.
I'm going to be flamed for suggesting this, but will say so anyways.
Get some old fashioned windshield sealant, it Butyl, the stuff that never goes hard. Put some in the groove the window goes into, not too much. Shove the window in the grove. That alone isn't easy to do.
Put some cord in the seal, where its supposed to meet with the metal.
place the windshield into the opening, fiddling and jigging until its in the just right place.
Inject some goop in a light bead around the seal. Do this at this time so you aren't getting goop all over the lip you are trying to bring into the Van, over the metal edging.
Play whack-a-mole all around the edge of the glass. Use you hand, its pretty strong glass. I'm not recommending this, because I'm not responsible if it doesn't work, but I took a stub of lumber (2x6, about 8 inchels long) and wrapped the end in a towel, placed it against the glass and hit it with a hammer at a certain point. Hitting the seal didn't do much, was necessary to hit the glass. Whacking with bare hands didn't move the glass enough. Window didn't break or crack, and I wouldn't have got it in without this technique.
bump, whack and do what's necessary until the seal is pushed against the metal lip. Don't start pulling on the cord until you are there.
At this point, the butyl goop will start acting like a lubricant, and make things a little easier, and it will also seal things up when done, two benefits.
Carefully pull the cord while the outside guy is whacking and pushing at the same place you are pulling, it needs to seal as you go, its not going to magically "pop" in place, you really have to shove it in, bit by bit.
There may be a best place to start the process, I believe I started in a lower corner, and worked my way up, then worked both the top and the bottom across.
If and when you finally have it in place, the seal is going to look like hell, because its too much on the glass, and isn't going to be in the opening. You'll see from where the clean metal is from under the old seal. Get yourself a length of lumber, 2x6 is good, not too small you want to spread out the impact. Wrap it in a rag or towel you can throw away, and hold it parallel to the window, end against the seal, and start whacking the seal into place, gently around and around and around. Whack just hard enough to make things move, and you'll eventually get the seal placed appropriately.
Figured on an hour, took all day.
To anyone who recommendes against Buytl goop .. two questions:
1) ever done this?
2) did it leak without the goop?
Goodluck.
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Derek May
- Posts: 217
- Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2001 1:01 am
Bay Window Bus Window seal AHHHHH!
oh.. forgot.
Seal Size? its correct size, the old seal has shrunk over time (letting water in), which is why you had rust you had to repair and are replacing it, no?
Use the Butyl, that's the answer. It lubricates on the install, and seals against water peneteration afterwards. use as much as you can tolerate cleaning up afterwards, and if you need to put it on the metal opening to get things going, go ahead, its just going to be messier and its better if you can avoid that.
I found WD40 was a good butyl solvent, but didn't attach the paint, rubber or glass. I think I had a hell of a mess of black goo to clean up afterwards, but I did get the glass in place : )
Seal Size? its correct size, the old seal has shrunk over time (letting water in), which is why you had rust you had to repair and are replacing it, no?
Use the Butyl, that's the answer. It lubricates on the install, and seals against water peneteration afterwards. use as much as you can tolerate cleaning up afterwards, and if you need to put it on the metal opening to get things going, go ahead, its just going to be messier and its better if you can avoid that.
I found WD40 was a good butyl solvent, but didn't attach the paint, rubber or glass. I think I had a hell of a mess of black goo to clean up afterwards, but I did get the glass in place : )
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SuperBeetle71
- Posts: 636
- Joined: Tue Jul 18, 2000 12:01 am
Bay Window Bus Window seal AHHHHH!
Thanks for the response. I got it half way in, which was more than ever. unfortunately it turned out to be off center so i have to take it out again.
I put glass-to-weatherstrip silicone adhesive in the groove that the glass goes in to keep out seepage. After working on it for a week, i realize that the front windshield bottom was really a weak design spot for the bay bus. There needs to be some drain holes there or something.
I put glass-to-weatherstrip silicone adhesive in the groove that the glass goes in to keep out seepage. After working on it for a week, i realize that the front windshield bottom was really a weak design spot for the bay bus. There needs to be some drain holes there or something.
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Pillow
- Posts: 2940
- Joined: Mon Oct 15, 2001 1:01 am
Bay Window Bus Window seal AHHHHH!
Personally I do not use the sealant, but have no beef with it either.
I just put one in a '74 yesterday and it took less than an hour for the whole thing. This includes the time soaking the seal and putting it on the glass before installation. I am far from a pro too, so some people can do a lot better than me.
First I soak the seal in hot soapy water. Then I lube the bus metal window channel with straight liquid dish soap. Once the seal has been soaking take it out and put it on the window completely seated. Then install the electric wire in the groove. Now is the time to put the sealing compound on the seal if you so desire, on the outer lip of the seal so it seats in the 90 degree lip. Now place it on the bus. Have a friend hold it from the outside holding the bottom so it does not slide out and then applying LIGHT pressure where you on the inside are pulling the wire out. I like to have my wire start on top at the rear view mirror and pull one side at a time, take it slow on the corners you want them to seal nicely. Use a screw driver to pull the wire otherwise you will hurt your hand with wire all bound up on it
As a general rule in life never force something in a hole that is not properly lubed
LOL
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Adrian Pillow
'66 VW Westfalia - "Biscuit"
'79 Porsche 911 SC - "Cochese"
I just put one in a '74 yesterday and it took less than an hour for the whole thing. This includes the time soaking the seal and putting it on the glass before installation. I am far from a pro too, so some people can do a lot better than me.
First I soak the seal in hot soapy water. Then I lube the bus metal window channel with straight liquid dish soap. Once the seal has been soaking take it out and put it on the window completely seated. Then install the electric wire in the groove. Now is the time to put the sealing compound on the seal if you so desire, on the outer lip of the seal so it seats in the 90 degree lip. Now place it on the bus. Have a friend hold it from the outside holding the bottom so it does not slide out and then applying LIGHT pressure where you on the inside are pulling the wire out. I like to have my wire start on top at the rear view mirror and pull one side at a time, take it slow on the corners you want them to seal nicely. Use a screw driver to pull the wire otherwise you will hurt your hand with wire all bound up on it
As a general rule in life never force something in a hole that is not properly lubed
LOL------------------
Adrian Pillow
'66 VW Westfalia - "Biscuit"
'79 Porsche 911 SC - "Cochese"
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Zen
- Posts: 387
- Joined: Fri May 25, 2001 12:01 am
Bay Window Bus Window seal AHHHHH!
I've yet to install a bus windshield but that will change soon as I have a replacement for my 73's crack one waiting on the seal to get here.
I've installed a LOT of glass on bugs however and have found . . . DON'T LAUGH, IT WORKS . . . K-Y Jelly is a very good lubricant. It doesn't hurt the rubber seal either. I use either 14 gauge automotive elecrical wire or a heavy monofiliment weed eater cord for the "cord." I use a short piece of a 3/4" dowel to wrap the cord around and pull . . . if you just wrap the wire or weed eater cord around your hand it gets mighty uncomfortable!
Hopefully next weekend I'll get to try my hand at installing a bus windshield . . . not only is my windshield cracked, the seal (the original seal!) is dried up and cracked and leaks like crazy when it rains.
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Zen Hendricks
"You can observe a lot by watching." -- Yogi Berra
Scenic City Volks Folks, Chattanooga, TN -- Where Air Meets Water! http://www.volksfolks.org
I've installed a LOT of glass on bugs however and have found . . . DON'T LAUGH, IT WORKS . . . K-Y Jelly is a very good lubricant. It doesn't hurt the rubber seal either. I use either 14 gauge automotive elecrical wire or a heavy monofiliment weed eater cord for the "cord." I use a short piece of a 3/4" dowel to wrap the cord around and pull . . . if you just wrap the wire or weed eater cord around your hand it gets mighty uncomfortable!
Hopefully next weekend I'll get to try my hand at installing a bus windshield . . . not only is my windshield cracked, the seal (the original seal!) is dried up and cracked and leaks like crazy when it rains.
------------------
Zen Hendricks
"You can observe a lot by watching." -- Yogi Berra
Scenic City Volks Folks, Chattanooga, TN -- Where Air Meets Water! http://www.volksfolks.org
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Pillow
- Posts: 2940
- Joined: Mon Oct 15, 2001 1:01 am
Bay Window Bus Window seal AHHHHH!
Zen,
Wonder what the neighbors think when they see you walking around with a 3/4" dowel rod and a bottle of K-Y LOL
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Adrian Pillow
'66 VW Westfalia - "Biscuit"
'79 Porsche 911 SC - "Cochese"
Wonder what the neighbors think when they see you walking around with a 3/4" dowel rod and a bottle of K-Y
LOL------------------
Adrian Pillow
'66 VW Westfalia - "Biscuit"
'79 Porsche 911 SC - "Cochese"
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SuperBeetle71
- Posts: 636
- Joined: Tue Jul 18, 2000 12:01 am