3-pt safety belts - front? rear?

chinacat · Post by **chinacat** » Thu Dec 12, 2002 10:51 am

Has anyone installed 3-point safety belts in their Things? I wouldn't mind the added protection at least in front, but I'm also considering setting them up in back as well.

BLTMEX sells new 3-point safety belts that they say will work in a Thing. My plan is to use a Thing Shop roll cage as the shoulder point for all belts. I've heard of people doing this with the front belts, but am not entirely sure how to best attach the belt to the roll bar without compromising it's structural integrity (i.e., I don't want to drill through it). Has anyone done this? If so, what's the best way to attach the belt to the cage?

With the rear seats, I'm wondering if it's even possible.

Any advice or insights would be greatly appreciated.

Advokat · Post by **Advokat** » Thu Dec 12, 2002 5:19 pm

Hey Chinacat, I want to do exactly the same thing. In fact, I called the Thing Shop and they told me folks do this all the time, but would not guarantee anything or suggest that it be done or even admit that their roll bar is anything more than a "show" bar.

Anyway, I guess we cannot blame them with all of the liability exposure.

Let us know what you do and attach some pix if possible. I, for one, am very interested in exactly how you mount the front belts.

Good luck

justcallmebob · Post by **justcallmebob** » Thu Dec 12, 2002 9:15 pm

Later Type-181's sold in Europe were sold with front 3 point belts. The factory added a very ugly extension pillar to the top of the door post. Perhaps someone in europe can comment. I believe the rears remained 2 point.

As far as meeting specific safety standards? Every little bit extra helps. Is there any doubt in anyones' mind that there are fewer cars in the world that one would less like to have a serious accident in.

The entire car, including driver and passengers is one giant crumple zone.

Good Luck

[This message has been edited by justcallmebob (edited 12-12-2002).]

Bob Ingman · Post by **Bob Ingman** » Thu Dec 12, 2002 11:53 pm

I have this set-up in my Thing. I do not think it is a compramise to the integrity of the roll bar to drill through it. It works very well. About the rear seat I have no clue. Bob Ingman

Stock93 · Post by **Stock93** » Sun Dec 22, 2002 2:45 pm

As for drilling through the cage and worrying about its structual integrity I might have a fix for that. Say you are mounting the belts with 1/2" bolts. You could drill a 3/4 inch whole in the tubing. Then use some 3/4 inch tubing that is 1/8" thick to weld into the 3/4" hole in the roll cage. Then you can mount the belts a little off of the cage if you want to. I hope I explained that clear enough. If not I can find you a picture or drawing.

John

dr. no · Post by **dr. no** » Sat Jan 25, 2003 8:28 am

Adding 3-point seatbelts is easily done with the usual 4-legged roll cage (call it what you want). A convenient source that keeps it all VW is the 3-point belts from Vanagons--then you have a take-up reel also. You can drill holes and mount the reel at the bottom and the loop at shoulder level, but if I were to do it again, I would weld a plate to the front of the bar (at the floor level) so that the take-up reel is not in the way of the seat. The Vanagon attach points look very Thing-like. The back works the same, but you will need to find a vanagon with rear-seat 3-points with a belt instead of a bar on the seat portion.

Jeff Lee · Post by **Jeff Lee** » Sun Jan 26, 2003 5:42 pm

We welded nuts to match the correct seat belt height for the mounting bolts onto the roll/show bar. We used the thickest nuts we could find and simply welded one onto the drivers side and on onto passenger side of the roll/show bar. We filled in the edge around the nut with puddled weld so it tapered from the roll bar to the top of the nut to add mass, this looked much better as well. This took about four circles of welding with the wirefeed welder. We then drilled out (to the inside of the nut diameter without touching the threads) with a smaller diameter through the roll/show bar(nut side only). We did not drill compleatly through both sides of the roll bar only the side with the nut welded to it. We then ran a tap through the nut, cleaning the threads and threading the roll bar in the process. Granted it's not SAE certified by should hold well enough in an impact.

We used grade 5 nuts and bolts. I imagine any would work.

I would not be too concerned with the three point sealt belts until the seat and tracks are u- bolted through the pan and the low back seats are replaced with high back seats.

I love my Thing but realize your going to get really hurt in any collision from the back without highback seats and u-bolted tracks and seat. Yea, a frontal crash would be better with 3 point belts but your neck is still going to snap without a highback seat.

Just my two cents worth.

[This message has been edited by Jeff Lee (edited 01-28-2003).]

SEMPER FI FOREVER · Post by **SEMPER FI FOREVER** » Mon Jan 27, 2003 10:03 am

My doorposts have a threaded mount built in where the hardtop connects. Was this created by the previous owner? it looks stock and allows for mounting the retractor assembly at shoulder height, better than floor level of rear seat.
I purchased the 3 point at http://www.salesco.com/seatbelt/, for $79.95, I thought this was pretty stiff. Has anyone found a better price?
Thanks jeff for reminding me that the seats are widow makers, my three point fits so secure that a good tail ender will probably rips the rails from the sheet metal floor. At least the visibility of the bright red shoulder strap satifies the cops.

[This message has been edited by SEMPER FI FOREVER (edited 01-27-2003).]

[This message has been edited by SEMPER FI FOREVER (edited 01-27-2003).]

Advokat · Post by **Advokat** » Mon Jan 27, 2003 7:47 pm

Hey Jeff:

I understand all about the u bolts and highback seats-I just got some highbacks that I will install soon.

But, I think I might have some brain damage as to the welding of nuts and drilling/tapping you described. Could you please try to explain this again as I would really like to understand how you set this up.

Thanks

Jeff Lee · Post by **Jeff Lee** » Wed Jan 29, 2003 8:10 am

I rewrote the note see if this makes sense to you. Thanks Jeff <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Advokat:
<B>Hey Jeff:

I understand all about the u bolts and highback seats-I just got some highbacks that I will install soon.

But, I think I might have some brain damage as to the welding of nuts and drilling/tapping you described. Could you please try to explain this again as I would really like to understand how you set this up.

Thanks</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

spaeth@gorge.net · Post by **spaeth@gorge.net** » Wed Jan 29, 2003 10:07 am

I actually was the one who put the belts in Bob's Grey Thing back when it used to be red and ugly. That bar in that car is really thick walled tubing. It is also fairly large diameter. I am sure that the roll bar is still way stronger than the floor it is mounted to. You need to remeber that it doesn't really matter how strong the bar is if it pushes through the floor! Unless you do some serious reinforcing under the cage it is only going to do so much good. Some day I want to put in a really cool 6 or 8 point cage. There is always something to add.
hope this helps,
Craig
the Gorge

Advokat · Post by **Advokat** » Thu Jan 30, 2003 6:19 pm

Thanks Jeff, that does make more sense now.

Rick