Some make me struts per Ray's directions???

justinshelton · Post by **justinshelton** » Thu Jul 03, 2003 7:35 am

Hi, Guys -

I have read through Ray's VERY COMPLETE instructions on how to modify Audi 400 strut inserts to fit my '71 411, but to be honest I just do not think I have the ability to do this myself. I've really capable of switching out parts on cars/setting valves/etc. but I'm just afraid to "remanufacture" the Audi struts.

I am curious if anyone on this list could make the modifications that Ray has outlined, then sell me the struts??? I can put them on myself. I would obviously pay for the cost of the Audi strut plus your time and effort . . . Any takers??

Thanks,

Justin

raygreenwood · Post by **raygreenwood** » Thu Jul 03, 2003 7:47 am

This is ungodly simple...but sounds ungodly complex. What I will try to do in the next week is draft this out...so you can see the parts and measurements...and just scan it in and post it. All you are doing is making a pair of spacers. One drops in...the other screws on and is tack welded for safety. Other than that...evrything else is simply identical to putting in new strut cartridges. The strut body and bushing is all 412 parts. Only the insert and the two spacers are new. Ray

justinshelton · Post by **justinshelton** » Thu Jul 03, 2003 1:16 pm

Ray - I'll give it a try if you say it's so easy! I once had a bad experience with my '70 bus's suspension rusting though - it literally fell apart while I was driving in downtown Indianapolis, causing me the careen across a 4-lane wide downtown street. Luckily no one was hurt, but it's made me VERY aware that I don't want to go thought anything similar!

I appreciate your help, Ray.

- Justin

ANT · Post by **ANT** » Thu Jul 03, 2003 3:02 pm

justinshelton wrote:Ray - I'll give it a try if you say it's so easy! I once had a bad experience with my '70 bus's suspension rusting though - it literally fell apart while I was driving in downtown Indianapolis, causing me the careen across a 4-lane wide downtown street. Luckily no one was hurt, but it's made me VERY aware that I don't want to go thought anything similar!

I appreciate your help, Ray.

- Justin

Hey Justin, you ever been to South Bend?
-ANT

raygreenwood · Post by **raygreenwood** » Fri Jul 04, 2003 10:33 am

I can greatly appreciate where you come from. This is also why I really push totally rebuilding the front end of a 412. Rust will rarely if ever be an issue. But, the strut bearings...especially the old pattern, can pull their bearings out of the socket....been there. The ball joints when old and worn, not only wear everything else out...they can break....thats the end when that happens. The valving on the cartridges I recommend are superb, They have the correct rate to keep from destroying anything and rattling your teeth...but are about 20%+ better control than factory. They have plenty of stroke range...but have too short of a body to reach the bottom of the bore...and too short of a top bolt to use the stock bump stop. The object is to extend the strut tube with a screw on coller that raises teh cartridge up to the correct height to maintain spring compression, and allow the use of the stock screw on cap for the strut top. A simple length of pipe under neath the cartrige finishes this off. After market or golf strut boots and bumpers work much better and are easy to get. The tack weld is simply to keep this from coming unscrewed, You can either make this scxrew on spacer by getting an old strut tube and having the top end trimmed off at the correct length, having the back end threaded, making a threaded connecting coller and screwing them together.....or trimming an old strut tube to the correct lenth and having it expanded at a good pipe/exhaust shop and internally threaded to screw onto the strut...or having the pieces macined rom one piece of stock to screw onto your strut. The original design I used is also good. That was a screw on top extension stub. That made no adjustments to the strut tube. Worked great, but you have to be more precise in the anchoring of it to the strut rod for safety...and it was about $200 of machine work. Ray

justinshelton · Post by **justinshelton** » Mon Jul 07, 2003 9:15 am

Yeah, I've been to South Bend - I lived in Indianapolis for 12 years, but am now in Colorado. I spent lots of time in Valpo with a girlfriend in the summer of '88 - I regularly drove up I-65 in the same bus that later had the rusted out suspension problems!

kg4me · Post by **kg4me** » Fri Jul 11, 2003 9:38 pm

Ray, when you get the details drafted....

I'd be interested in getting them from you... please e-mail them to me and even though I can re read your old threads if you have any text explanations, instructions to go along with a basic drawing I would greatly appreciate it.

showop1@quilts.com

raygreenwood · Post by **raygreenwood** » Fri Jul 11, 2003 10:44 pm

No problem. Sorry I am so slow in posting details guys...this has been the busiest 5 months in ages. Lots of real job work...little time for fun job work. The struts designs, the center link reapir kit, the gas tank boot and the copper MPS plates are all in the 3/4 phase at the same time. I have working parts for all of them and am using them. The boot and the plates have a few details I am still wary of before I sell them to anyone...so it may be september for those. The fixes for the centerlink may be done this weekend. I am sizing up some parts tommorrow that may make the strut mod even easier.
The only Audi part in this strut is the cartridge. The rest of it is all 411/412. The bump stop and boot can be anything you want that fits...but the golf/jetta boot and stop is readily available and works well.
There is one more really awesome mod I have recently made to the strut set-up....that is really not necessary...but makes the whole design just slightly more modern and makes turning thesteering wheel smoother and causes less wear to the strut bushing and internal seals.
It uses a delrin radial 2 part bearing on top of the top spring plate. Its like a miniature lazy susan made of very slick plastic. Its very similar to the supplimental bearing some of the late model Audi struts use. Its about $19 ea. and they are from....a Mazda 626 of all things. The mod is to drill the hole in the top plate where the strut rod threaded section protrudes....completely through so the strut rod itself can past through it. The bearing is about 2mm thick and simply looks like a plastic disc. It sits between the plate and thestrut bushing/bearing assembly at the top. It has an inner flange so as not to damage the strut rod. Its purpose....is to allow the top plate to turn easier so it does not load up the spring...or grind on the bottom of the strut bearing. It also allows the strut rod to turn in the upper strut bearing completely and easily.....this stops the strut rodfrom turning inside the gas charged section. It keeps wear way down...and stops premature seal wear and gas loss. The cartridges last longer. Its one of the few small tricks modern struts use to last very high miles. I may need help in posting this drawing completely...so I may be asking for help. Ray

kg4me · Post by **kg4me** » Sat Jul 12, 2003 10:08 am

Ray, if you get even a basic "field" drawing with accurate dimenisons I can get your design/mods drawn up on autocad... if this would be a help just let me know. E mail me anything you have so far and I would like to discuss a few things with you, I am in Tx too. thanks K

raygreenwood · Post by **raygreenwood** » Sat Jul 12, 2003 10:52 am

Cool! Thanks! Ray

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Some make me struts per Ray's directions???

Some make me struts per Ray's directions???

Okay, if you say so . . .

Re: Okay, if you say so . . .

Yeah, I've been to South Bend . . .

Ray, when you get the details drafted....