OK, injector seals in...

ubercrap · Post by **ubercrap** » Sun Feb 20, 2005 3:38 pm

Any way to test spark without a helper?

raygreenwood · Post by **raygreenwood** » Sun Feb 20, 2005 4:25 pm

Yep...but it involves bare wires...pain, a puddle of water and an electrical socket......

.

Actually, you should go to the FLAPS.....on the funky tools aisle...look for a spark plug tester. It is a little threaded tube...spark plug size...with a gator clip on it. Take a spark plug....leaving all four in the engine....and screw it into this fitting tight. Clamp it to the blcok....pull one of the wires off and plug in the plug. Then start the engine and idle. It will idle ok on 3 cylinders...But te spark plug will be sparking where you can see it. If you want to...pulkl the injector plug on that cylinder as well. They are about $6 . Ray

DeathBus · Post by **DeathBus** » Sun Feb 20, 2005 5:09 pm

I think he wants to test spark while cranking the engine? Spark plug tester wont help while your at the steering wheel.

vwbill · Post by **vwbill** » Sun Feb 20, 2005 5:20 pm

How about a remote starter switch to turn it over and then you can hold another plug connected to the plug wire and then to ground to see if the wire is getting juice. But if you're trying to test the plug in a run condition you can plug the wire for change at the cap or I have seen someone use a tester to ground out the wire to ground with the needle of the tester? Bill

raygreenwood · Post by **raygreenwood** » Sun Feb 20, 2005 6:56 pm

I think you guys may have misunderstood what I was illustrating. This "part" actually holds onto a spark plug and grounds it for you...to the block. It allows you to leave all four original spark plugs screwed into the head so that there is no compression loss or danger of an explosion. But yes....if the car does not alreday start on its own...a remote starter would have to be used. All you have to do is pull off one of the plug wires and hook it to this plug...and every time the dizzy fires whatever that lead was attached to...the exter nally mounted plug fires...in open air so you can see it. All of this is non body contact. Very safe. Ray

DeathBus · Post by **DeathBus** » Sun Feb 20, 2005 7:10 pm

aw heck just leave an open fuel line in the car and unplug a plug wire from the cap and see if there is a spark!!

I see where you are coming from Ray.

vwbill · Post by **vwbill** » Sun Feb 20, 2005 7:48 pm

Yeah, Yeah! I know what Ray's talking about! I've seen them at Napa.
Is it that clean thing that plugs on top of the spark plug and has a ground lead? Then you can see the color of the gap! bill

ubercrap · Post by **ubercrap** » Sun Feb 20, 2005 8:36 pm

No, the car won't start, that's why I am wanting to check to see if there is any spark. I guess I'll just recruit my father during the week to help.

vwbill · Post by **vwbill** » Sun Feb 20, 2005 11:47 pm

Hey Ubercrap, sorry you're having the start problem! I know how frustrating it is workin without help also! So let us know what you have checked so far? Do you have a test light or meter? Have you checked for power to the coil? Do you hear the fuel pump relay clicking and the pump running alittle when the key is first turned on? On my car I had the copper ground wire on the point plate that was causing a big problem!
Do you have the Djet bottom points that trigger the injectors? Those can be a big issue! You arent having that issue with the safety system like longbeach? Have you marked the distributor and then checked the mark in the fan for tdc and 28 degree mark then set the motor to tdc number one by pulling the valve cover for the number one/two side so you see when the valves are closed? You can set the timing kinda close that way with a test light to the points so you can see when the points just open.
I think Ray said it is somewhere around 10degree in a static setting. The timing is a big issue with the 412. Sorry for all the questions but if you let Ray and the other pro's know some of the test you will get her to turn; they helped me to get mine to turn over! bill
p.s. dont get too frustrated with her yet I had big problem to get mine to just start also!

ubercrap · Post by **ubercrap** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 6:51 am

Yes, I have a multi-meter. I haven't checked for power to the coil, that's next on the list. I'll have another look at the distributor to see if I can see what ground wire you are talking about. The fuel pump runs for a few seconds when the key is turned to on. It is D-Jet apparently, there is a plug going to the lower section of the distributor. What issues should I look for with the D-Jet trigger points? Same as other points? I haven't looked at them. The car cranks over fine, so the interlock has been bypassed successfully. I don't have any reason to believe the timing is off, so I think I'll check the other stuff first, but I'll keep the timing in mind if I'm not successful.

DeathBus · Post by **DeathBus** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 6:55 am

Are you working on the 73 or one of the 74's?

Look at the Vins

if the third number is a 3 then the car is a 73

1st number
4 - for type 4

2nd number
1,2,3 - trim level

3rd number
3 or 4 - 73 or 74

(from left to right)

Your condensor might be shot along with your points, do you know if you are getting gas back to the injectors? While your cranking the pump should run, but only with the key in the crank position. When the car runs the pump with stay on.

MGVWfan · Post by **MGVWfan** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 7:39 am

And if you've got a Variant, the 2nd digit of the VIN will be a "6", see Jens Vagepohl's Type 4 site...

http://www.type4.org/technology/chassisnumbers_html

ubercrap · Post by **ubercrap** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 7:53 am

Well, I think it's a '74.

I only have a bill of sale and the prior registration for this car. I haven't applied for a title yet so I haven't even looked on there to confirm the year. I just assumed it was a '74 because of the aluminum bumpers?

Whether this is D-Jet or L-Jet, well, do to my ignorance, I'm not sure. I am roughly familiar with their differences in theory, but identifying them by sight is a different story.

I was under the impression that '74's had L-Jet, but then the evidence was pointing the other way, because it has the "triple hookup" pump that was identified as D-Jet, as well as having a plug on the side/bottom of the distributor, which I thought identified it as D-Jet?

DeathBus · Post by **DeathBus** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 8:00 am

ubercrap wrote:Well, I think it's a '74. I only have a bill of sale and the prior registration for this car. I haven't applied for a title yet so I haven't even looked on there to confirm the year. I just assumed it was a '74 because of the aluminum bumpers? Whether this is D-Jet or L-Jet, well, do to my ignorance, I'm not sure. I am roughly familiar with their differences in theory, but identifying them by sight is a different story. I was under the impression that '74's had L-Jet, but then the evidence was pointing the other way, because it has the "triple hookup" pump that was identified as D-Jet, as well as having a plug on the side/bottom of the distributor, which I thought identified it as D-Jet?

Thats why I said look at the Vin on the dash, that will tell you flat out what you have. Sounds as if you have 73's with d jet and alumin um replacement bumpers OR 74's that have been backdated with D jet, I would think its the first rather than the second.

ubercrap · Post by **ubercrap** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 8:14 am

Well, one would almost think that the bumpers have been changed, but they can't interchange very easily due to their completely different mounting systems. I'll know soon enough, as I go home during lunch, and I'll take a look. Maybe the 2dr.'s have some exceptions to the general type 4 rules of year identification?

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OK, injector seals in...

OK, injector seals in...

What cha testing for?

Yeah!

Hi Ubercrap!