Muffler differences

Longbeach412 · Post by **Longbeach412** » Sun Apr 10, 2005 7:50 am

Hey yall, my muffler is in rough shape and there is one on ebay but it looks different. mine (a 74) has the tail pipe on the end and EGR port, while that one has it off the middle and no EGR port. Are those just cosmetic differences, or would I have fitting problems with the rear grill? Also, would I have to cap off and remove the EGR system with no trouble?

albert · Post by **albert** » Sun Apr 10, 2005 8:36 am

hi,,longbeach, the muffler on my 412 73 is midle exit with the sound pipe on the left side and i d,t can instal the loove vent gril on the back , the original muffler is on the right side , my car run with that but it is not original, i look for to buy new on BUGHAUSE.COM for appx 160.$

ubercrap · Post by **ubercrap** » Sun Apr 10, 2005 9:55 am

Right, I think I recall that middle-exit muffler isn't as good as the others.

raygreenwood · Post by **raygreenwood** » Sun Apr 10, 2005 1:33 pm

There were four basic varieties. The end exit...left or right......and damper style (middle exit) left or right. They are all basically correct and have been sed from teh factory for various reasons. The middle exit type are quieter...but more restrictive. All will fit fine behind the rear grll. Ray

can86 · Post by **can86** » Wed Apr 13, 2005 7:26 am

I also need a muffler for my 72 411 sedan....What did that have? I only know of a few sites that sell them

Post by **Marc** » Wed Apr 13, 2005 7:41 am

IIRC the 411 originally had the center-exit/damper style:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayI ... gory=34203
...I'm not sure if the damper & t'pipe are still available for this style, you may want to go to the end-exit `73/`74 bus type instead.

Longbeach412 · Post by **Longbeach412** » Wed Apr 13, 2005 8:59 am

check it out on ebay, the guy seems to have a good supply and relists them regularly without any takers. They're no good for me though, I need the end exit type and I think for now, I'll just weld up mine.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Apr 13, 2005 9:08 am

i've been watching those ones on ebay...just was never sure

what's the lo-down on the mufflers these places sell? for my 411

http://www.evwparts.com/Merchant2/merch ... pe4Exhaust

http://bughaus.com/newpage4.htm

Post by **Marc** » Wed Apr 13, 2005 9:16 am

Dunno. They look like Leistritz.
I wonder what JCWhitney is selling for $120 (+$12 for t'pipe)?
http://www.jcwhitney.com/autoparts/Prod ... y/ss-10110

can86 · Post by **can86** » Wed Apr 13, 2005 12:24 pm

ahh, that was me i forgot to log in. I'm gonna need to get a muffler soon, but i'm unsure what which to get, can anyone recommend any of them? thanks!

raygreenwood · Post by **raygreenwood** » Wed Apr 13, 2005 3:16 pm

Marc is hitting things on the button again

. The damper pipes, as far as most people in teh last two years can confirm, have pretty much been discontinued. Of course, since the companies that make them are still in business....they could probaly start anytime they see reasonable demand...and may have.....who knows? But...if you lie the damper style...and they are good muflers for bone stock, get teh center pipe from JC whitney. $17 is a steal on that part. They reatail for about $30+. Also, if the gasket and clamp bolts are kept clean and tight and you give teh damper pipe a derusting evry couple years, it can last through about 3 mufflers.

Back in the 80's, I bought several mufflers from Whitneys. Always been good...and all were either Leistritz (excellent quality) or Lange (subsidiary of wagner?...usually very good). I have seen little or nothing from wagner in about 8 years except that known to be NOS.
Ocasionally you see a brand called starlighter. These were almost identical to the Lange/Wagners.

In that second ad.....with the top and side picture, The top view does indeed look like a Leistritz. They were generally more correct in having al of the lumps and bulges needed to clear all sheet metal configurations and teh oil dipstick tube...and less puckering in the stampings. But...and I'm sure nothing is color correct.....the bottom picture looks like a Dansk...only because they are the only oned that use the dark battlesip gray paint....and....the inlest hole welding is usually so ragged....I would face that muffler downward too...

...

If you get mufflers for cheap...and wanted to do a little work....and wanted to make them flow 10% or so better.....then cut the outside case off...just one side, the one opposite the inlets, with a cut-off wheel just around the inside perimeter of the machine welded seam. Take that plate off. Replace the final exhaust center tube...with one slightly larger...with holes about 1mm larger. You will have to clearance the exit flange for the larger pipe....then do one or two tack welds inside and then weld the exit mouth to the flange. Put the outer plate back on, the nweld it, then grind it smooth.
The Ernst versions of this muffler flow some 15% better than the rest. The body is slightly larger for more interior volume, but the big change is slightly larger center pipe and holes. Ray

Post by **Marc** » Wed Apr 13, 2005 3:38 pm

The JCWhitney damper pipe is for 15/1600 II, it wouldn't fit the 411 muffler (too small, too sharp of a bend).

raygreenwood · Post by **raygreenwood** » Wed Apr 13, 2005 4:55 pm

Dang hadn't noticed that little tidbit! Thanks for the info Marc. Also by the way, when you find a damper pipe.....make a note wether the one you need is for right or left. There is a clamp bolt difference and abracket diffrence. I "think" that if you detached the bracket and clamp boltwelds...and flopped the pipe the other direction and re-welded...it should fit. Ray

vwbill · Post by **vwbill** » Wed Apr 13, 2005 6:20 pm

Hey how does that one on JC whitney work with the heat exhangers?
I must be missin something,lol! Were you guys talking about modifying the orignal muffler with the side exit or mid exit by changing the interior baffles? bill

Longbeach412 · Post by **Longbeach412** » Wed Apr 13, 2005 6:42 pm

The Bughaus ones are no good, they're out of stock!

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