Ghia Road Course Setup

[FJCamper]

Hi DORIGTT,

Are you talking about having the transaxle axle centers ahead of the rear wheel centers, so that the axle is at an rearward slant?

FJC

[DORIGTT]

Yes FJ.

I'm looking to move the added bulk forward to help with the tail-heaviness and to help fit the 915 which is definitely longer than the standard Ghia trans.

Why, what did I do wrong now?

[FJCamper]

Hi DORIGTT,

You get points for creativity, but if you did this, you're making the axle work at a forced angle. A dirty little secret about CV joints is the very best of them create friction as they work, and the more that they flex off straight, the greater the friction. The general impression just by the name "constant velocity" joint is that they happily spin, flex, and there are no penalties.

For a really good video of this, go to: http://www.thompsoncouplings.com

The best arrangement of a jointed axle is straight and level with the ground.

FJC

[JWP]

You want a little bit of offset to promote even wear. However, straight is better than an extreme angle.
The friction of moving the 6 balls back and forth gets significant when you multiply it times 4.

[ONEBADBUG]

When I built my A-Mod car, I did this to move weight forward. My only concern was performance, not durability or efficiency or anything else. I was worried about it because I could not see any examples of it being done, and because of concerns about weird torque reactions. It worked great, no issues at all. Never broke an axle or CV joint, and the grip under acceleration was good.
13.2 quarter mile only gaining 5 mph in the second half because of the huge wing. I had about 2 inches of offset in there, I would guess.

[DORIGTT]

@ ONEBADBUG,

My goal is the same.

With the offroad guys, they're abusing these things with more extreme angles than would be seen by my car. This being said, some of the Aussies are doing this very successfully in competition cars which is what led me to consider this. 930 cv's can handle more extreme angles to the tune of 28 degrees or so vs. 17 I think for the standards.

[FJCamper]

Gentlemen,

Very interesting. You know the saying:

"If it's stupid but it works it ain't stupid."

FJC

[Fiatdude]

pedal works in San Bernardino has some great pedals too

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/ ... id=1154459

http://www.pedalwerks.com/

[Bruce2]

A friend of mine builds fake Speedsters. He uses VW swing axle short torsion bars (552mm), but with IRS spring plates (for 676mm bars) and TAs. This allows him to install the center anchors for the torsion bars much further apart than any VW ever had. Then he moves the whole gearbox & engine forward 2" to help weight distribution.
By using the short bars, he opens up the gap between them by 248mm!
http://www.intermeccanica.com/

[RHough]

Hi PeteW,

By "bump," if you mean bump steer, we run stock settings as we are only lowered two inches (is this this droop you ask about?) on 53 via our Puma axle.

261 is at stock ride height as it has to deal with real-world Mexican roads.

If I've misunderstood your terms, let me know.

FJC

Two questions.
Would the coil over shocks work on the rear also? I think no easy way to set corner weights would be a setup problem.

You mentioned using 2" drop spindles on the front, to get the rear dropped 2" also do you just re-index the torsion bars?

R

[FJCamper]

Hi Randy,

If you are lowering the front with dropped spindles, I'd lower the rear with adjustable spring plates. We use them on our swing axle Ghia and (LeMons/Chumpcar) road-racing 1973 Super Bug.

Adjustable spring plates allow for weight jacking and are cheaper and more simple than coil-overs.

I don't know if you've seen the post under Suspension: ADVENTURES IN ADJUSTABLE SPRING PLATES.

FJC

[RHough]

Hi Randy,

If you are lowering the front with dropped spindles, I'd lower the rear with adjustable spring plates. We use them on our swing axle Ghia and (LeMons/Chumpcar) road-racing 1973 Super Bug.

Adjustable spring plates allow for weight jacking and are cheaper and more simple than coil-overs.

I don't know if you've seen the post under Suspension: ADVENTURES IN ADJUSTABLE SPRING PLATES.

FJC

Thanks!

Any concern/desire/need to make the front suspension adjustable side to side?

R

[FJCamper]

Hi Randy,

No special problems with the front suspension. No need for any more adjustability than camber. For that, you have ball joints.

Use the stock torsion leafs in the axle tubes, and adjust roll stiffness with your front swaybar.

In that you're building a street and track car, I wouldn't worry too much about vintage racing rules. VARA or HSR cares a lot about appearance, cosmetics. Your car is going to have to look period correct more than be period correct inside the engine.

FJC

[Max Welton]

Please excuse me if I missed this. Is there anything special you do with the steering-box?

Max

[FJCamper]

Hi Max,

Other than having a steering box well lubed and adjusted, all we do is relax the steering box bolts, front wheels off the ground, move the steering wheel back and forth a couple of times to let it "center" itself on the upper tube -- and cinch it down tight.

Because we lower by tire height, we don't have bump-steer problems.

And our preference in steering coupler disks is stock rubberized, but we've had no special troubles with urethane. I just worry that the urethane may split.

FJC