This is actually for a 912E, which is similar to the 914 with the same engine.....anyway
My car went dead for no apparent reason a couple of weeks ago. Here are the facts:
Battery good and charged
Terminals good
Cables good
Fuses good
BRAND NEW SWITCH (electrical)
BRAND NEW STARTER & SOLENOID
Switch in run position...everything works great i.e. radio, lights, wipers, heater, etc.
Turn to the start position......NOTHING!!!!
I'm going mad.
Sorry for the rant!
Is there any safety switches like seat belts fastened or E brake on or Clutch in or something like that, that could have been bypassed and got crossed somewhere? The last time I drove it (seems like forever ago) I was fiddling with the heater controls to get my heater going. Also, the "fasten seat belt" light is always on ??? I reached up and wiggled some wires to see if I could get that light off.
I can start it with a starter button.
Any more ideas???? Help
Thanks...Dan!
Starting Problems ??
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Dave_Darling
- Posts: 2534
- Joined: Thu Apr 27, 2000 12:01 am
No extra switches that I know of in the 912E.
Check the ground strap like Glenn says. (Hi, Glenn!)
Do you know if you're getting spark? Fuel? Is the starter not cranking? Any power to the gauges? Any power anywhere?
Start trying to narrow the problem down. If you have power to the gauges, then try jumpering the starter to see if it cranks. (Make sure the car is OUT OF GEAR when you do this, or you may wind up with a Darwin award for dying by running over yourself.)
--DD
Check the ground strap like Glenn says. (Hi, Glenn!)
Do you know if you're getting spark? Fuel? Is the starter not cranking? Any power to the gauges? Any power anywhere?
Start trying to narrow the problem down. If you have power to the gauges, then try jumpering the starter to see if it cranks. (Make sure the car is OUT OF GEAR when you do this, or you may wind up with a Darwin award for dying by running over yourself.)
--DD
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Piledriver
- Moderator
- Posts: 22779
- Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2002 12:01 am
Assuming it's the std ignition switch (remember, switch and lock cylinder are TWO parts) I'd look at that very, very closely.
It's probably 30 years old.
It's time to invest $30 in a DVM from Sears or such, and learn how to use it.
Failing that, a $5 idiot probe light can tell you much, like "am I getting power out of this?"
Also, at least on the 914, the power to the starter solenoid goes through a couple of seat/belt sensor interlock relays under the passenger seat.
Due to the cars ages being the ~same, I would assume the 912E had the same brain damage of the era, mounted somewhere.
These were usually bypassed back when the cars still looked new, but the "repair" might need some work after 30 years.
It's probably 30 years old.
It's time to invest $30 in a DVM from Sears or such, and learn how to use it.
Failing that, a $5 idiot probe light can tell you much, like "am I getting power out of this?"
Also, at least on the 914, the power to the starter solenoid goes through a couple of seat/belt sensor interlock relays under the passenger seat.
Due to the cars ages being the ~same, I would assume the 912E had the same brain damage of the era, mounted somewhere.
These were usually bypassed back when the cars still looked new, but the "repair" might need some work after 30 years.
Addendum to Newtons first law:
zero vehicles on jackstands, square gets a fresh 090 and 1911, cabby gets a blower.
EZ3.6 Vanagon after that.(mounted, needs everything finished) then Creamsicle.
zero vehicles on jackstands, square gets a fresh 090 and 1911, cabby gets a blower.
EZ3.6 Vanagon after that.(mounted, needs everything finished) then Creamsicle.
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Dave_Darling
- Posts: 2534
- Joined: Thu Apr 27, 2000 12:01 am
The 74 914s, and some of the 75s, were the only ones inflicted with the Dreaded Seatbelt Interlock Relay crap. I don't think the 76 cars (including the 912E) had them--I could be wrong, as my experience with the later cars is not extensive.
That is definitely a good point; it is possible that there is something like that going on...
--DD
That is definitely a good point; it is possible that there is something like that going on...
--DD
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raygreenwood
- Posts: 11907
- Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2003 12:01 am
A couple of things to check. The actual contact strips that are interlocked through the seat belts are in the seats. If the system is still hooked up these contact strips operate any time anything over about 25 lbs in in a seat. There will usually be a small zipper on each seat bottom cushion on the inside area near the e-brake location. If something heavy was sitting in a seat for a long period of time...it could damge the contact strip. In order to start you would then need to buckle thesafety belt of that seat. Or....the two wire plug that coonects teh seat strip...could be pulled loose and could cause a no start. Look under teh seat and you should see a cord running down one leg of the seat frame to a plug near the end of the seat rail. One of those wires from the stationary plug...IIRC...is a ground and screws to the body. Check that.
You could also have rust down in the seat belt female end....or just dustiness. Either way...the seat belt light on signals an open circuit and a no start.
This is a 912 so I am assuming it has a stndard transmission. If not....if for some reason it is an automatic...there may be a neutral safety switch like teh type 3 and 4 had down under teh shifter bezel. Ray
You could also have rust down in the seat belt female end....or just dustiness. Either way...the seat belt light on signals an open circuit and a no start.
This is a 912 so I am assuming it has a stndard transmission. If not....if for some reason it is an automatic...there may be a neutral safety switch like teh type 3 and 4 had down under teh shifter bezel. Ray
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cdadaa
- Posts: 23
- Joined: Sun Dec 22, 2002 12:01 am
I got it started but....
Thanks for all the input!! I got it going. It turns out that there was a kill circuit wired in to the cigarette lighter!!?? So when the lighter is pushed in the circuit is complete and will start. When the lighter is out, the circuit is dead. Clever but a pain in the a$$. I got a new switch and starter out of the deal!
It starts and runs but doesn't idle now ! It dies at 1300 rpm. I probably did something when trying to fix the other problem and created a new problem. What on the L Jetronic FI would cause the engine to die (or not maintain an idle) at idle??
If it's not one issue it's two others!
Thanks all...Dan
It starts and runs but doesn't idle now ! It dies at 1300 rpm. I probably did something when trying to fix the other problem and created a new problem. What on the L Jetronic FI would cause the engine to die (or not maintain an idle) at idle??
If it's not one issue it's two others!
Thanks all...Dan
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Dave_Darling
- Posts: 2534
- Joined: Thu Apr 27, 2000 12:01 am
High idle: Advanced timing, or a vacuum leak with extra fuel going in. Or a leak past the throttle of metered air.
Not idling: Wonky ignition, vacuum leaks. Unplugged wires, or broken wires. Broken or mis-adjusted EFI parts.
In other words, "Just about anything!" Go back and double-check everything you might have touched. Then check it again. Go through the vacuum hoses and the wires, making sure all are in good shape and properly connected. Then make sure the engine has good compression and the valves are adjusted. Then check the ignition system out very thoroughly, making sure the timing and dwell are in spec, and you're getting a nice fat happy hot spark. Then start checking out the FI components...
--DD
Not idling: Wonky ignition, vacuum leaks. Unplugged wires, or broken wires. Broken or mis-adjusted EFI parts.
In other words, "Just about anything!" Go back and double-check everything you might have touched. Then check it again. Go through the vacuum hoses and the wires, making sure all are in good shape and properly connected. Then make sure the engine has good compression and the valves are adjusted. Then check the ignition system out very thoroughly, making sure the timing and dwell are in spec, and you're getting a nice fat happy hot spark. Then start checking out the FI components...
--DD