Ideas for fiberglass on real of rail

[DWP]

I am taking a vacation from work next week with the idea of finishing up the details of my "street rail"
Picture of first test last fall
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_ ... _id=737647
In order to get a "special constructed title" in PA I need to cover the rear engine cage, top and bottom. The plan is to wrap the top and sides with plywood to make a base for the fiberglass, Paint and wax the plywood so I can remove it from the fiberglass. The area around the carbs will be open. How long between layers of fiberglass should I wait before I lay up the next layer?? Any other ideas. I wish I could just cover the area with heave mesh. The only thing in the state motor vehicle rules is that the engine has to be covered, except "street Rods" No clear rule of what they mean by cover.
More pictures this weekend, all reasonable comments entertained. Note drives like a go cart on steroids.
DWP

[Ol'fogasaurus]

I would challenge them for clarification of what it means by "engine covered" before you get too busy making something (they must have an idea ‘cause how can the referee something that they don’t have instructions for. If they don’t know, they should find out. This is not much different than a rod and maybe even safer as you have a cage and side bars). You could easily go way overboard and waste time and money or you could build something that would not satisfy what they want. I don’t know how persnickety your state is but it has to be more lax than WA is (a rail buggy is not allowed on the road here anymore assuming it ever was) because they allow you to put a rail on the street.

I am fairly new to glassing but so far, it seems that you can keep working adding new layers but we also move from front to back of the body so things do set up before we get back to that area again. I would also go to a real fiber glass shop as there are more materials available than just a paint supply house or place like Lowes or Home Depot would carry. Many mats and thicker materials used to get bulk in a build.
http://www.shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic ... &start=105
"The next to last post is what I wanted to point out: I went up to get some more fiberglass mat yesterday and was able to run some questions by the owner. We had run out of mat so I got talking about mat vs. cloth to him, telling him that we were adding thickness to the mounting flanges by using mat; his response was asking why we were not using rove (I think that is how it is spelled). Rove looks like cloth except it has a very wide (material) weave and is pretty thick. He said that mat short strand temporarily stuck in higgly-piggly manner, is the stickiest (best bond) and is OK for build up but the rove is going to give more thickness with less material. He said; cloth, then mat, rove, mat, rove, and and-so-on finished with cloth for a total of at least 3 layers. He also said that the use of rove is going to use a lot more resin (probably double of more) also so I doubled my purchase of resin.

I also talked to him about the amount of catalyst we were using and he agreed with what we are doing vs. the weather conditions was right. I told him I was worried about too much heat buildup by using more catalyst and he said it would take a lot more catalyst than we were using to get that much heat going."

There is more there that might help.

On the Spike channel the other day, on the Muscle program they are working on a altered wheel base ’64 Comet and they made a new hood for the injectors to come though the hood using the old hood as a plug. The process was time consuming and tedious but the outcome was a wonder to behold. I haven’t been to the web site to see if you can view it there but I know it can be purchased.

I don’t think glassing over wood is going to give you what, in a short time, you want as the picture of the rail you posted says you have some pride in what you do. It might be easier to make friends with someone in a sheet metal shop and have them bend up something for you. A lot of places around here will do that for car guys for a nominal or even free (you pay for the materials usually at cost). Look at the book How to build a dune buggy by Earl Duty. One of the last chapters is titles “Fabricating the Body Panels” and it shows how it is done.

If I can be of any help, let me know.

Lee

[DWP]

Thanks for the info. For got to mention that I already have the berrin buggy body for the front and sides. I did order my glass stuff from uscomposites.com. The idea for the plywood is just to support the fiberglass until it sets. Getting information from the state about the body thing is like talking to my Son, useless. Monday I need to stop at some of the "enhanced inspection Stations and see if they have any ideas.
In PA you need to have your "kit" car inspected by an enhanced inspection stations, take pictures. Fill out forums and mail all this to Harrisburg.
Wait for a reply, change something, mail back , etc. Then they provide a new title and vin number.
But as far as I can research, there is not a clear definition on engine cover. Bumpers need to be a certain height, not sure how wide. I do need to cover the wheels with fenders, just not sure what wheels I am going to use. I do know that getting this thing legal will be as much work as building.
DWP

[Ol'fogasaurus]

They were making a female mold from a good hood they modified to a plug and using the plug to make a new hood One thing that was said was that you don’t have to spare the Bondo on a plug, you could have it 4’ thick if you wanted to as it is only to make the final part. Again, they kept saying that things had to be perfect before you go to the next step which included painting the plug to a perfect shape and sanding out all imperfections before they made the mold. You would probably not be making the mold but going straight to a part. They have a special wax and parting agent on the plug before they started glassing. Again, not knowing what you really have to do it is hard to advise other than what I have already.

I have heard, but have no proof, that on the Meyers Manx Forum the little 'cycle fenders that they had on the Tow'd were (could be) being made again. Again, I am not sure if this is true at all as I am not a member; the one time I tried to find out I was blocked out because of not being a member ID. They are really "cute-si-pie" and look very nice. When I was doing rods we used ’35 Ford spare tire covers and cut them down.

Lee

[Ol'fogasaurus]

For ideas, look at David 58's rear wing with fenders. How about a variation of this:

http://www.shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic ... start=1035

I put the other set of Jack Mans I have on the front that are wider and have a better off set.





I am working on the wiring harness and hope to have it done later today. Pics too later.

Turbobaja made a nice wing too. Maybe something like this would do:

http://www.shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic ... 5&start=15

Heres what I've been up to the last few months. It's been one of those things that lingers in the back of my mind for a long time now. I really didn't know how it would turn out, so I just started making something and this is what I got so far.



I made it out of .25" plywood first to get the basic shape. Then I picked up a 4x4 sheet of .125" 6061 T-4 (slightly more bendable than T-6, I guess) to cut the panels from. The whole idea for this contraption is to get some air to the coolers and maybe add a little stability for the occational 100mph blast.





I put a couple scoops on the drivers side to direct some cool/fresh air to the Air filter. The series of .5" tall ribs along the top are to help direct air down the 1.0" holes through the coolers. There will be some foam gaskets around both coolers to seal off the air flow.



I put this sheet of stainless over the factory air inlets to restrict airflow into the engine 'compartment' from above the spoiler surface, hopefully forcing more air to flow over the top and down through it. Idealy there will be an area of low pressure under the coolers to draw air through them, at least that's the idea.





The spoiler will be removable (to run/tune/show) and the coolers are self supported. The intercooler prettymuch supports itself. I had to make some support brackets for the oil cooler & t-stat to keep them in position. Both coolers are mounted to the underside of the spoiler with rubber insualted mounts so the intercooler can move with the engine and not jerk the spoiler around too bad. The whole thing is just mocked up for the most part right now. I still have 5 more mounting points to make and more pop rivets to pop than I care to count. This is the first time the whole thing has been assembled on the car, so I had to throw the tires and fenders on real quick to get an idea how it's overall shape looks. It's going to take a little gettin used to I think. All this shiny stuff will look much more appropriate once its been painted or coated somehow.



Here I am making the final cut along the trailing edge with the plasma. A friend of mine granted me access to a large sheet metal brake to bend the rear lip and both sides. Nothing like the right tool for the job.

The hunch-back is from years of labor and lack of elbow grease

Actually thats just a weird angle of my right shoulder..........I hope.

Here's all the puzzle pieces.



Total of 7 Dzus mounts and 2 countersunk pinch bolts to secure the lower tips good and tight. Just in case this thing makes some downforce, or just a whole bunch of vibration and drag. I don't want it falling off.



I reinforced the little horns that support a lot of the weight of the spoiler with some 18 ga exhaust tubing. I didn't want to weld them for fear of warping the narrow stretch of sheat metal and making a lot more work for me. So I riveted the outer edge and all the riv-nuts that the mounts bolt to are riveted through both body and the reinforcement, so they're in there good. Had to keep them pretty low pro with the carbs right next to them.



All the odd shaped mounts can be unbolted from the body. Hopefully it will make doing the body work a little easier. Plus I can powder coat them this way


Finally assembling it for the LAST TIME. 3/16" large heads for the structural, 1/8" along the ribs on top, all black oxide coated with backing washers.









About 165 pops later, here she is. The scoops and Dzus fasteners will be installed after paint. Whole thing only weighs 15lbs. Feels real solid when it's mounted up too.

Just have to do some minor structural reinforcements to the cage and it's time to get the body straight enough to paint.

Oh, and I pretty much have to hand make a fuel tank. The rack/front cage structure took up some much needed volume in the tank, and its gotta be up front in this rig. I'll think of something, eventually.

Steady as she goes.

Karl

It also might be as easy as a belt cover over the drive belt. An engine cover could mean just about anything.

Just a couple of thoughts.

lee

[dstar5000]

Your car IS a street rod!


Don

[DWP]

A Street rod in PA is has to be 1948 or older, They have to have a cover on the top but not the sides, they also do not need fenders. I don't think I can get away with that claim.
I do like the metal work, something to think about. This weekend we will mock up a body design, pictures to come.
DWP