Hi all: it’s been a REALLY long time, but life, and death, frequently intrude on our plans.....
So, I have been searching the ‘net for awhile, but Not having any luck on upgrading a BJ suspension using VW or Porsche parts similar to 944/type 3 stuff for the rear. I am considering a kit car, and drawing a blank on the front suspension. Are there any interchangeable parts similar to the rear upgrades besides Ghia brakes? After all the changes life has thrown at me, budget is a pretty serious concern. Thanks for any and all comments.
Front suspension
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Ol'fogasaurus
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Re: Front suspension
Question:ravenshurst wrote: ↑Fri Apr 19, 2024 8:19 am Hi all: it’s been a REALLY long time, but life, and death, frequently intrude on our plans.....
So, I have been searching the ‘net for awhile, but Not having any luck on upgrading a BJ suspension using VW or Porsche parts similar to 944/type 3 stuff for the rear. I am considering a kit car, and drawing a blank on the front suspension. Are there any interchangeable parts similar to the rear upgrades besides Ghia brakes? After all the changes life has thrown at me, budget is a pretty serious concern. Thanks for any and all comments.
What are/were the original build components and what will be the use of the "TOY?
It can make a difference as to the use of the toy as to what to use. Also, where is the build going to be done as what is available/where the parts will be from.
Lee
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ravenshurst
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Re: Front suspension
Hi Lee; Well, the only parts I currently have are a complete-but-unrebuilt type 4 2.0 bus engine and an unused rancho freeway flyer. The “toy” will probably be a ‘glass- bodied spots car. I REALLY like Porsche 356 speedsters, but the prices are sky high at the moment....
‘Toy’ isn’t really the right word, as the planned use is daily driver. I don’t need a race car, but there are a LOT of lonely desert roads, mountains, and canyons around here. I Really like to design, build, and tinker. I want to stick with the standard beetle front end. The rear end suspension has been well worked out by others long before me; T3 squareback torsion bars, T3 drums, 930 or bus CVS &tc......
I just haven’t found much info about front ends. Sorry this is so long.....
‘Toy’ isn’t really the right word, as the planned use is daily driver. I don’t need a race car, but there are a LOT of lonely desert roads, mountains, and canyons around here. I Really like to design, build, and tinker. I want to stick with the standard beetle front end. The rear end suspension has been well worked out by others long before me; T3 squareback torsion bars, T3 drums, 930 or bus CVS &tc......
I just haven’t found much info about front ends. Sorry this is so long.....
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Ol'fogasaurus
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Re: Front suspension
https://www.shoptalkforums.com/viewtopi ... s#p1304007
This is some information on the change from the bug suspension to the Thing suspension. Not hard to do but the components might be getting hard to find. In my Black Buggy build there is more info on this plus it shows the stock bug BJ setup vs. the Thing setup.
Basically, the lower ball-joint on the bug presses in from the top of the arm down with the spindle's lower is connected on top of the arm. The Thing is pressed in the same way, but the difference is that the connection is now on the underside so that hard loading is going to have the arm take up more of the load not allowing the BJ to be pulled out of the arm like the bug unit can have done.
I also (if you are going hard off-road then add the stops like I show in the "Black buggy build" and add some strength material to the shock tower.
Also adjusters can be added (in a couple of different ways) to change the height of the suspension and to soften the suspension if needed.
There are other things that also can be done assuming there is room for them to be done.
The "Thing" suspension is hard to find now days. Try to get the whole mess not just the spindles as (if I remember correctly) the upper BJ adjuster is different due to the geometry change you will now have.
Lee
This is some information on the change from the bug suspension to the Thing suspension. Not hard to do but the components might be getting hard to find. In my Black Buggy build there is more info on this plus it shows the stock bug BJ setup vs. the Thing setup.
Basically, the lower ball-joint on the bug presses in from the top of the arm down with the spindle's lower is connected on top of the arm. The Thing is pressed in the same way, but the difference is that the connection is now on the underside so that hard loading is going to have the arm take up more of the load not allowing the BJ to be pulled out of the arm like the bug unit can have done.
I also (if you are going hard off-road then add the stops like I show in the "Black buggy build" and add some strength material to the shock tower.
Also adjusters can be added (in a couple of different ways) to change the height of the suspension and to soften the suspension if needed.
There are other things that also can be done assuming there is room for them to be done.
The "Thing" suspension is hard to find now days. Try to get the whole mess not just the spindles as (if I remember correctly) the upper BJ adjuster is different due to the geometry change you will now have.
Lee
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ravenshurst
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Re: Front suspension
Hi Lee; Thanks for the reply. I had some thoughts about T3 suspension components, but I am still sorting out which are the beefier 181 specific parts and which are the same as T1 components. I will read your thread immediately. Thing spindles raise the front end, correct? This will be a pavement only car. I would like to use dropped spindles and ghia discs on the front. Thanks again. Off to check that those threads.....
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Ol'fogasaurus
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Re: Front suspension
I don't think the type 181 spindles raise the suspension as the upper BJ is basically the same (except for the adjuster). It is the lower arm of the Thing BJ that is located different so the spindle's lower arm is lower than the stock Bug spindle. This lower arm again, is to keep the ball-joint from being pulled out of the lower torsion arm on "hard hits" (even on the street) by the suspension.
Adding adjuster(s) can help raising and lowering the front end and also stiffness of the ride.
I never have dealt with the type 3 stuff, so my help is going to be somewhat weak in that area.
Lee
Adding adjuster(s) can help raising and lowering the front end and also stiffness of the ride.
I never have dealt with the type 3 stuff, so my help is going to be somewhat weak in that area.
Lee
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Ol'fogasaurus
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Re: Front suspension
This shows the Thing front suspension on a bug beam.
Lee
Lee
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Ol'fogasaurus
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Re: Front suspension
One other thing I would suggest is to have the shock towers internally inspected from the top to the bottom for internal rust.
The drains at the bottom have a tendency to collect dirt, dust and therefore rust. I got my beam all the way done including the stiffening of the shock tower to the beam tubes, the suspension stops when I found out that the bottom of the tower was rusted through and the fix was useless, but it didn't show on the outside.
I live in a wet state so I would suggest even if you don't live in one have the inspection done.
Start over... which I haven't done yet.
Lee
The drains at the bottom have a tendency to collect dirt, dust and therefore rust. I got my beam all the way done including the stiffening of the shock tower to the beam tubes, the suspension stops when I found out that the bottom of the tower was rusted through and the fix was useless, but it didn't show on the outside.
I live in a wet state so I would suggest even if you don't live in one have the inspection done.
Start over... which I haven't done yet.
Lee